Cedric and Pettigrew (was Re: Faking Sirius' Death?)

[tonyaminton]

No: HPFGUIDX 91708

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "pippin_999" <foxmoth at q...> 

SNIP>>>>>>>>>>>  Sorry for that....

> Pippin stretches out on the knoll:
> Ahhh, now we're on firmer ground. The conspiracy to frame 
> Sirius is canon. There was information that Sirius was 
> Voldemort's most devoted servant, prepared to out himself as 
> Voldemort's second-in-command. Peter, in hiding or on the lam, 
> could not have spread this rumor on his own. The DE's in 
> Azkaban knew that Peter, not Sirius, betrayed the Potters.   And 
> they were very, very sure that Peter was dead. Which is odd, but 
> we'll get to that in a moment. 
> 
> First let's think about what would have happened if Voldemort 
> hadn't met his downfall in Godric's Hollow.  How was the 
> conspiracy to play out?  Any plan to discredit Black must also 
> encompass a plan to silence Peter. He's the only one who can 
> prove that Black is innocent. That's a huge liability for 
Voldemort. 
> Peter must not remain alive to face questioning by Dumbledore 
> and the aurors. If Peter was to fake  his death and  go into 
hiding, 
> he wouldn't be much use as a double agent anymore, in which 
> case why bother  framing Sirius at all? Answer: there's another 
> double agent and Peter is expendable.
> 
> Now I agree, Peter is not quite the fool everyone takes him for. 
> He knows that as soon as he's played out his part, he's toast.  
> He's been told to let Black catch up with him in a crowded place, 
> shout "Lily and James, how could you?" and kill Black. Little 
> Peter, the hero, Order of Merlin, first class.  But he guesses the 
> real plan will be for someone to make it look like Black killed 
> *him*. Peter foils the plan by cutting off his finger (he could 
have 
> done that *before* he let Black catch up with him) and 
> transforming into a rat. The curse which was intended to destroy 
> him misses and disposes of twelve unfortunate Muggles 
> instead.
> 
> Sirius thinks Peter did it, holding a wand behind his back. But 
> that means Sirius couldn't have seen it. According to the Muggle 
> witnesses, Peter never got his wand out at all. So once again a 
> curse comes out of nowhere. We must consider the possibility of 
> another wandsman, or perhaps someone who is skilled enough 
> to fire a curse without using a wand at all.
> 
> Now the DE's in Azkaban know that Sirius didn't betray the 
> Potters. They know that Sirius wasn't one of them, and Voldemort 
> never taught him any tricks, like how to kill twelve people with 
> one spell. So how can they be sure Peter's dead--unless one of 
> their own did it? 
> 
> Eustace:
> > Despite Voldemort's disdain, he did manage to capture Bertha 
> Jorkins.  (In fact, our opinion of Wormtail's intelligence and 
> magical skills are primarily derived from sources of 
> questionable value--the three fellow Marauders who treated him 
> badly back in school and Voldemort, who delights in belittling 
> him even as  Wormtail performs the excruciating task of 
> rebirthing Voldemort.)  <<
> 
> Pippin:
> Not quite. Neither Flitwick nor Hagrid contradicts McGonagall 
> when she says that Peter was hopeless at dueling and not in a 
> class with the other two talent-wise. And we've seen for 
> ourselves how much Peter envied James's physical 
> coordination. 
> 
> > Eustace_Scrubb again:
> > 
> > Well, the whole wand echo scene has been a problem since 
> the first printings allowed James' ghost to precede Lily's.  JKR 
> fixed that, but if she and the editors missed something that big, I 
> wonder what otherdetails were also neglected or simply not 
> considered important.<<
> 
> Pippin:
> Well, that's the strange thing the dog did in the night, isn't it? 
> Usually JKR admits her Flints with cheerful chagrin. She's 
> acknowledged that she once thought boa constrictors were 
> poisonous, that ancestor/descendant was a muddle, that good 
> ole Marcus spent an extra year at Hogwarts. But the wand order 
> correction was made stealthily, and many people felt that the 
> original passage was stronger. So why not just apologize openly 
> or else write the mistake into the story somehow? 
> 
> The consensus on the list was that priori incantatem will be 
> referred to again, and it will  be important for it to operate as 
> originally described. And of course JKR said there was a huge 
> clue on that page. It wasn't the James Lily swap. So what was it?
> 
> Eustace:
> >the only time {the robes] would have been obscured would 
> have been for the few moments that the steam from the
> > cauldron filled the air. 
> 
> Pippin:
> And for the moments before that, when the sparks were so bright 
> that they turned all else to velvety blackness.
> 
> Eustace:
> > A most stealthy second wandsman it would have been to 
> return the wand to the robe pocket without Harry
>  noticing. I'm guessing (no proof, mind you) that Pettigrew put it 
> in as he was preparing to enrobe the risen Voldemort.<
> 
> Pippin:
> Harry can only see what's directly in front of him. If I was 
> Voldemort, I'd want  somebody on Pettigrew like ugly on a Troll 
> until the rebirthing spell was completed and Pettigrew's job was 
> done.  My theory is that once Voldemort was safely in the 
> cauldron, our stealthy second wandsman darted in  and put  the 
> wand in the pocket. As you say, it had to get there sometime.  
> According to your theory Peter would have to pick up the robes 
> with one hand, and with the same hand, manage to get the wand 
> into the pocket unnoticed. Quite a feat! 
> 
> Eustace:
> > I still think Occam would blame Pettigrew.<
> 
> Good. I'd hate to think I was giving it all away <veg>. 
> 
> Pippin
> "The truth is out there. The lies are inside your head"--Terry 
> Pratchett


Now Tonya---

WOW Pippen--- What a great post!!  I am totally convinced.  
Everything makes sense to me. I was really looking for anything that 
didn't add up but your theory is good!!

SO, I wonder how long it took you to come up with that??  Where did 
the theory come from??  If this were all true then where do YOU think 
that JKR is taking us??  Who could be the traitor?? and WHY??

Please Pippen do go on!!

Tonya (I have really enjoyed this whole thread!!)