Time travel is dangerous (part 2)

[nkafkafi]

No: HPFGUIDX 88948

> Neri wrote:
> As my test case I use the Ron=DD theory, which is discussed as part 
> of the knight2king theory (read all about it in 
> http://www.knight2king.net , hoping I got the link right this 
time). 
> JKR can save herself from paradox by devising just two histories. 
> This may be termed the Double Loop Ploy (DLP): Ron travels 130 
years 
> into the past, and becomes DD. He does everything he can to prevent 
> LV rise to power, and succeeds, but this causes an unexpected, 
tragic 
> turn of events. Say, in this history DD fails to defeat 
Grindelwald, 
> so there is a war all over again, only a different war with another 
> Bad Guy. Somehow, a Ron is born in this history too, and this Ron 
is 
> also, somehow, transported to the past. Note that this is a 
different 
> Ron (call him Ron-2). He must be different because he has a 
different 
> history, H-2. In fact, it might not even be Ron this time around. 
> 
> vmonte wrote:
> Yes, I sort of understand your idea that there could be more than 
one 
> timeline going on (I don't even want to begin thinking about this 
> idea). I don't know if time travel, Ron=DD, is the right answer to 
> why DD seems to know more than he should, but I do think that it is 
> possible, and there are many clues pointing in that direction.  
> Of course, he could just be a (real) Seer who is subtly trying to 
> manipultate history.

Neri responds:
The problem is how to get a scenario in which DD knows many things, 
but still does not know how everything ends up. In the last case, 
either he can act upon his knowledge and change the past, which 
creates a paradox unless you take the special measures I suggested, 
or he does nothing, which (I fully agree) is against the theme of 
decisions and free will. It would indeed be much easier to make DD a 
seer, because a seer (presumably) does not always know everything 
that's going to happen. 

> 
> One thing I don't believe is that the time-line is 
> fixed /unchangeable. It is very obvious that DD (at different 
times) 
> manipulates the characters in the books (yes, like chess pieces). 
> (Many fans have pointed to the fact that DD is almost playing 
puppet 
> master with the children.)
> 
> I can reconcile DD's manipulation of the time-line, if his 
> transportation back into time was/is accidental.  (I cannot blame 
> someone for trying to change history if they are trying to save 
> lives, blah blah etc.) 
> 
> I do think that if time-travel is involved at all it will 
ultimately 
> show that people must take responsibility for their actions. Time-
> travel is an easy fix! (I completely understand why fans of the 
books 
> would feel cheated if in the end no one really had free choice/free 
> will.)  
> 
> I believe DD will come to realize that time-line meddling never 
> really changes history, not because it is the law of the time-line 
> continuum, but because people have free will, and no matter how 
much 
> you try to protect loved ones they are the ones who should be in 
> charge of their own destiny, blah blah etc. 
> 
> Meddling may only delay what will eventually happen anyway.

Neri responds:
Imagine that by the end of Book 7 it turns out that DD is Ron, and 
Harry asks him: "why didn't you tell me that if I'll go to the DoM 
Sirius will die?". What would DD answer? "Because I believed you 
would have gone anyway"? I wouldn't have accepted such an answer if I 
was Harry, and I won't accept it as a reader.
  
> 
> I think DD was trying to save Sirius (change history) when he had 
> Hermione and Harry time-travel with Buckbeak, and when he forced 
> Sirius to remaine at OOTP headquarters--in the end DD only ended up 
> delaying Sirius's death.

Neri responds:
A nice theory, but again, this means that DD comes from an 
alternative history H-2, (in which Sirius was executed by the end of 
Year 3), and this opens the whole nest of pixies I tried to contain 
in the original post.
 
> 
> Finally, no one really knows how the books are going to end (except 
> JKR), but I think that if DD=Ron via time-travel, or DD is a Seer, 
> Rowling will ultimately remark that people need to be accountable 
for 
> their actions. Time-travel is like the Mirror of Erised.  You can 
> either live in fantasy, never accepting what life has given you, or 
> you can make the best of it that you can.

Neri responds:
I fully agree with you about the accountability theme. As I explained 
in the original post, however, if JKR wants to stay consistent and 
not contradict herself, then time travel is going to be *much* more 
complicated than the Mirror of Erised.