Re; Re: Is Snape a pureblood?

[junediamanti]

No: HPFGUIDX 89738

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "justcarol67" 
<justcarol67 at y...> wrote:
> --- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "sawsan_issa" 
<sawsan_issa at e...>
> wrote:
>> > Sawsan here:
> > Well if we remember back to OotP at Grimmauld Place, the Black
> > ancestry listed the pureblood families who intermarried. No one
> > mentioned Snape's name while observing it, which leads me to 
believe
> > that he is not a pure blood. Most likely if the snape family is
> > pureblood, their name would be up there 

The Black Family tapestry cannot be taken as a full and authoritative 
list of the pureblood families.  While Sirius's remark that "the 
pureblood families are all interrelated" OOP P105, UK Edition seems 
not to admit of any exceptions, there is AT LEAST one definite stated 
pureblood family who are not referred to, or present in the 
tapestry:  The Longbottoms - who are precisely stated in COS to be 
purebloods.  

> > 
> > Also, in the piensive scene, when Snape calls Lily a mudblood, she
> > seemed to take it like, ' I know YOUR not talking'. At least 
that's
> > the way I read it.

Use of the "mudblood" slur, again does not exactly determine the 
purebloodeness of the slurrer.  Snape does use it, and I do not think 
he has any intention at that moment other than insult.  Yes, indeed 
he is under stress at that point, which does NOT excuse such  a slur. 
Being under stress does NOT excuse racist abuse.  Full stop and 
that's the point of that moment.  

At least one mixed blood wizard uses the slur - Tom Riddle in COS.  
Which means it is NOT exclusive to purebloods, but that pureblood 
wanabees use it too.


> > 
> > SO i do not think Snape is a pureblood, but still is very
> Slytherinish :P

Tom Riddle is again proof that Slytherin will at least accept mixed 
blood wizards, though it seems almost certain that Muggle borns, like 
Hermione would not be admitted.
> 
> 
> The tapestry has to be incredibly detailed. Even going back three
> generations, to Sirius's great grandparents, you'd have four couples
> (eight people). Another generation back would be sixteen great great
> grandparents. Sirius and Harry were only looking at the last two
> generations (their own)--if a twenty-year age difference even
> constitutes a generation in the WW. If we (the readers) had been
> allowed to look into the wizarding genealogy that was mentioned as
> lying nearby, I'm pretty sure that we would have found the Snape
> family mentioned (and possibly the Potters as well). Sirius, unlike
> his mother, had no interest in his pureblood relationships except as
> they affected his relationship with his cousins Bellatrix, 
Andromeda,
> and Narcissa and their respective husbands and children, and of 
course
> with the Weasleys. He could easily be related to Snape and not even
> know it.

Not a family connection that Snape would probably welcome with any 
great enthusiasm.

Snape as pureblood: Pros and cons in summation -

Pro:

Head of Slytherin
Uses the Mudblood racial insult
Snape was a Death Eater and therefore at least a one time supporter 
of Voldemort, which may imply pureblooded support for Voldemort's 
anti-Muggle views.
He is apparently friendly with and respected by Lucius Malfoy, who 
will have very little to do with Muggle borns and mixed blood 
families.

Con:
Mixed blood students are or have been in Slytherin (Riddle).
Tom Riddle was of mixed blood and is the biggest pro-pureblood 
fanatic of the lot.  Snape may by a kind of mini-Riddle.
Like many senior Nazis in Germany - Snape may well have suppressed 
certain unwanted details of his ancestry.

It's a class thing:
He comes over to me as rather aristocratic.  He certainly has the 
arrogance and the hauteur.  I've studied the argument that certain 
behaviour of Snape in canon is at odds with the concept of his being 
upper class, ie the swearing and the spitting.  Not so.  Aristocrats, 
certainly many British ones, do not feel they have any duty to behave 
well. If they behave well, it is because they want to. "Noblesse 
Oblige" is a French remark and not a British one! They do not see 
themselves as bound by petit bourgeois definitions of what is "good 
form" and therefore will spit and swear if they feel like it.  

Equally, I will in the spirit of fairness point out, before someone 
does it for me, that he shows no such self-assurance in OOP -
 "Snape's Worst Memory".

However, while his birth may well have been honourable, it looks to 
me very much as though his family background was impoverished.  This 
may account for the dingy appearance and lack of confidence. Imagine 
coming from a good family and not having the wealth that you feel 
ought to go with it!  Which would add an extra reason for his joining 
Voldemort's cause.  Such a person would be a sitting duck for 
Voldemort's anti-Muggle line. 

June