Sirius revisited

[cubfanbudwoman]

No: HPFGUIDX 104403

SSSusan:
>>> I thought I liked him; I thought I could *fairly* easily defend 
him if I gave some time & thought to it.  But you two have stunned 
me into thinking I can't.  I mean, saying he has a whim of iron 
[great phrase] strikes me as so true, and it does seem to follow 
that if faced with a personal stance that goes against good vs. 
evil, well, *would* he make the tougher choice??  I'm not so sure. 
<<<
 
Kneasy:
>> Oi! None of that! Stick to your guns, you may yet be right.  Just 
because there's a couple of posts that slipped past your guard, 
that's no excuse to give up on Sirius. What is needed is *proof* - 
and so far nobody's seen any. Persuasive verbosity is no match for 
eventual canon. Theories and suppositions are fun to construct but
mean little unless JKR gives them the  nod. As a leading light in
the Sirius Protection League you can't falter now. Have you no
faith in your hero? <<
 
Jen: 
> OK Kneasy, I have proof that Sirius is meant to be a good 
> character. Sure, you've heard it before, but it's basically 
> irrefutable fact: JKR made his animagus form a dog. It's that 
> simple! A dog, a pack animal, an animal who believes there's no 
> shame in establishing a pecking order and that some dogs get to be 
> alphas and some dogs don't. He's fiercely loyal to his pack, 
> unafraid of crossing other animals who wander into his territory, 
> and follows instinct rather than reason. There, Sirius in a 
> nutshell.
 
> Even in Potterverse, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. If JKR 
> tells me Pettigrew turns into a rat when he transforms, then we 
> find out he ratted out his friends, well that's enough information 
> for me to decide what Sirius' character is (and wonder why they 
> never suspected Pettigrew was the spy?). He can be ferocious, and 
> might go bad if provoked enough, but Sirius' true form is innately 
> loyal and eager to please.
> 
> Jen, loyal member of the Sirius Protection League


SSSusan:
Woo hoo!!  I go to bed, wondering if I can think of how to answer 
Kneasy, and get up to find that Jen has taken care of it quite 
nicely for me. :-)  I shouldn't be surprised at that, as Jen & I are 
quite eerily like-minded when it comes to all things Potter, and she 
is a better writer & theorizer than I am.  It's been interesting to 
read Carolyn's & Andromeda's additional responses to Jen.  I love 
the Sirius-as-Big-Black Dog explanation, and it answers some things 
for me.  

Carolina's post [104382] has also gotten me into the mood to 
actually come back & defend Sirius a bit!  She wrote:

> Sorry to dissapoint you and Jen but I can't consider Sirius being a
> dog a good proof here, just by the kind of dog he is. He's a big 
> black dog, and that for me has always been the image of a hell 
> dog. Of course, only talking of symbolism here.


SSSusan:
I recognize your absolute right to respond to the symbolism any way 
you like, but I do wonder whether lots of owners of black labs 
wouldn't have a *very* different reaction to Sirius-as-big-black-dog 
than this.  I know I didn't think of him at ALL as a hell dog.


Carolina:
> I can't trust Sirius no matter how hard I try, and I've tried.
> Somehow, his story doesn't add up.

> Don't know wich poster said he liked him in GoF but less in PoA and
> the worst came in OoP.  I'd liked a PoA or GoF Sirius if they were 
> the same. But it give me the chills anytime I read anyone of them 
> and then the other. After adapting to a Sirius, I have to cope 
> with someone I don't know, and to asume it's the same person.
>
> I won't enter on the point-by-point discussion, because it has been
> heavily covered by all sides.

> I've been thinking about this thread, and 24hrs, and ended asking
> myself a question. Well. Sirius is bad. So what. How does it change
> the plot?


SSSusan:
That's interesting that you got chills when reading Sirius' 
character in any successive book and found him unrecognizable.  I 
wasn't the one who said so to the list, but I am one who found 
Sirius harder to take in OoP.  I enjoyed him in PoA and GoF.  And 
while I found him harder to take in OoP, I didn't get the sense that 
he was written so differently as to be unrecognizable as the same 
person.

To me OoP Sirius was a lot like OoP Harry.  Sirius was surly, 
grumpy, argumentative and more reckless in OoP.  I think this was 
due, in large part, to his inability to DO anything--useful or 
otherwise.  He wasn't even able to turn into his Big Schweetie Dog 
Self and romp around; he just felt trapped in GP.  

Lots of people didn't care much for Harry in OoP either, with all 
his outbursts and snarkiness.  *I* felt that he was spot-on what I 
would expect him to act like, at that age, facing what he's faced, 
and feeling that he's being both kept in the dark and ignored by 
DD.  He was ANGRY and resentful of the burdens thrust upon him, and 
I understood that.  I also understood Sirius' frustration and anger 
in OoP.  Neither was necessarily pleasant to read about, but I 
thought both were written as to be understandable.

As for the contention of Sirius as BAD, I find I can't go that far.  
I've come to realize his flaws may have been deeper than I first 
wanted to admit, and I've come to acknowledge that he was likely 
more selfish than I first realized.  But I don't agree that he was 
BAD.  He wanted to be useful, he loved Harry, he hated Lord Thingy & 
the Dark Arts, he was loyal to his friends.  He was flawed, but he 
wasn't BAD, imo.

There.  Does that reinstate me in the Sirius Protection League, or 
does it leave me firmly atop the fence??

Siriusly Snapey Susan