Ringdear of the Marauders: Sirius or James? (was Kreacher the Murderer)

[M.Clifford]

No: HPFGUIDX 104978

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Brenda M." 
<Agent_Maxine_is at h...> wrote:
> First, apologies to Valky, I rearranged your post 104531 to make 
this post more coherent -- please forgive me!
> 

Done!
Though I am not sure I can forgive your implying, later in this 
thread my sexy favourite of the HP Series could be more interested 
in Snape than cute and clever little blonde chicky like... well.... 
me :(
LOL 

>  Valky wrote in Message # 104531:
> > So Sirius is very very intelligent, 
> 
> 
> Bren now:
> 
> Absolutely. Sirius is incredibly sharp, both street AND book 
smart. 
> And I imagine Sirius will be very keen on anything fishy going 
around, especially a plot against himself. The lad had been living 
in his  worst nightmares for 12 years, I say he still remains very 
paranoid to this day. And Kreacher's timing was perfect, with Sirius 
stuck in that grim-old place. I suspect you'd need whole bunch of 
unusual ingredients for Befuddlement Draught though, wonder how 
Kreacher got his hands on that without Sirius knowing?!?!
> 
> 
Valky;
Good Point. but I suspect easily answered since he's been alone in a 
house for so many years that once was inhabited by a sinister witch 
I would suspect that she'd have had a few such items hidden away in 
the pantry which is frequently mentioned to be very near Kreachers 
hideaway. Probably concealed by elf magic.
 
I said: 
> > When I imagine all the Marauders together and consider their 
> > roles in their group I am certain that Sirius was 
> > intelligent, in fact somewhat in Hermione's league I think. 
> > I see James as having been highly gifted but a bit of a 
> > dunderhead a bit like Ron, and Lupin as someone who's stand out 
> > feature is his inner strength like Harry. Of course they are 
their own people essentially ..... 
 
> Bren now: 
James seemed too goody-goody in the beginning. It was in PoA, when 
McGonagall  said "Hogwarts has never had a pair of trouble-makers 
like them" (paraphrased) that I started liking James more. And OoP 
was definitely interesting.
It struck me odd though, when I was reading all the posts re: 
Animagi and what it means. How Stag is the alpha-male dear and Dog 
is a faithful, dead loyal (literally) and best-friend. But why 
though? What makes James more 'alpha-male' than Sirius?
> 
James: brilliant, talented, brave, athletic, wealthy, pure-blooded, 
bully, popular ... but mid-height, average-looking, somewhat mild 
(as far as we know, relatively speaking)
> 
Sirius OTOH: ALSO brilliant, talented, brave, wealthy, pure-blooded, 
*bully*, *popular* (pretty sure he was athletic too, just not a 
sports TEAM player)... but tall, "very good-looking" (probably had a 
line up of girls), aggressive, hot-bloode/impulsive, rebellious, 
owned COOL motorcycle (and the list goes on)...
> My guess is that Sirius WAS the Man of Men, with James the main 
man in double acts, and so on. 
>
But after JAmes' death and HArry's unfortunate upbringing, which is 
widely blamed on Sirius as the betrayer, there was a shift 
in "evaluating" the Marauders. James, who most people sympathesize 
with, became the Alpha-male, and Sirius being put aside to the 
second.
>

Valky:
I like your take, it is sensible and logical. Even so, I think that 
James was the Alpha male anyway.
To demonstrate I will give you my take on the James, Sirius traits.

Sirius; Extraordinarily Smart and Good Looking (did have a stream of 
admiring girls please read ch 28 OOtP where it is said re Sirius "a 
girl sitting behind him was eyeing him hopefully, though he didn't 
seem to have noticed." ) , broody and unable to see anyone with who 
he could truly empathise, a fairly high amount of talent but relied 
mostly on his intellect, I dont really think that being wealthy and 
pure-blooded meant all that much to him actually in fact I think he 
probably resented those things about himself most of all and in a 
way was envious of Lupins more struggling and challenging exsitence.
And finally Hot blooded, a very passionate person.

James; Extraordinarily Talented, a natural at everything, didn't 
really need much intellect, pureblooded and wealthy like Sirius but 
also nonplussed about his privileged existence and as such the only 
one Sirius felt could empathise with him. A typically loud and 
boisterous personality as a front concealing insecurities. Entirely 
too adventurous for his own good, not afraid of much at all.

It was James sense of high adventure that Sirius liked most about 
him. 
Sirius' only way of dealing with his troubled feelings was brooding 
and aching. James had somehow managed to distract from it by living 
the dangerfilled extreme kind of life that Sirius had only 
previously dreamed of. 
So it was James that rescued Sirius from his anguish of never 
feeling that he was worthy. Somehow it had never flowed with Sirius 
that Pureblood or wealth made you a cut above the rest his 
resentment of having had no real expectation to be anything 
worthwhile placed on him is very clear. 

So in this way although Sirius possessed a great many qualities of 
an Alpha type male he simply could not realise them, he really was 
bored with himself.