Snape's Destiny/JKR quotes

[cubfanbudwoman]

No: HPFGUIDX 105259

"vituperative404" <mbenkin at a...> wrote:
> > My guess is, one good flashback of Snape crucio-ing a Muggle 
> > toddler will be enough for even the most die-hard Snape advocates 
> > to start looking over the evidence for the Defense. And while I 
> > think Snape is endlessly entertaining and a complex character if 
> > there ever was one, anybody who's done torture/murder/what-have-
> > you with a smile on their lips and a song in their heart is not 
> > going on my Christmas card list.
 
Kneasy:
> Oh, I don't know. To  quote W.C.Fields "Anyone who hates children 
> and animals can't be all bad."

SSSusan:
It's comments like this, Kneasy....  Well. ;-)


Kneasy: 
> In the constant to-ing and fro-ing about Snape and Sirius which 
> seems to be one of the dividing lines between the fans, I think 
> there's a basic mis-understanding of where some people are coming 
> from. I think that I can claim credit for first using the 
> identifying labels "Siriophiles" and "Snape-aholics" that 
> highlights the difference.
> 
> Siriophiles *like* Sirius; they think he's lovely, sexy, maltreated 
> and for all his faults basically cuddly.
> 
> Snape-aholics find ole Sevvy fascinating, they can't get enough of 
> him, but they're under no illusions - he is a deeply unpleasant 
> character.  Most of them would/will probably be disappointed if he 
> ever reforms. It's not often that you find a well written, credible 
> villain in fiction these days and when one does turn up, it's lip-
> smacking time.


SSSusan:
But check out my handle.  I enjoy *both* characters.  I'm not sure 
there's always a dividing line.  I *like* Sirius.  Sexy, yes, that 
thought did occur to me.  Maltreated--well, crappy family, unfairly 
imprisoned, lost his best friends & feels tremendous guilt about it--
yeah, I guess that fits.  I don't find him CUDDLY, though.  I *like* 
Sirius because I have an impression that, in spite of his faults, he 
had a tremendous capacity for FUN which likely would have resurfaced 
again had he lived & the White Hats won.  Another very important 
reason that I like him is because of what he represents and MEANS to 
Harry.  I adore Harry [yeah, I know, you're rolling your eyes :-)].  
I don't make excuses for everything he does--I'm not a BLIND follower-
-but I really identify with Harry.  And Harry WANTS Sirius in his 
life.  I empathize w/ Harry's feelings.

Snape *is* deeply unpleasant.  I will confess that, after going on a 
Rickman!Snape binge and returning to canon, I can actually do 
a "Whoa!  I forgot how unpleasant he is!"  I don't want him to REFORM 
so much as to discover that there is some good in the mix.  He's a 
nasty bit of work, he surely did some awful things in the past, he's 
an often-effective but nasty teacher, but I think there is something 
good in there--and THAT'S what I find intriguing.  If we discover (as 
I suspect you hope, Kneasy) that Snape hass NEVER been about anything 
but what's in it for himself, then I think I *will* be disappointed.  
Remember, I'm not saying he should be reformed in the end so much as 
I'm saying I want to discover why DD trusts him so, and that I'm 
hoping the answer includes some small but important measure of 
goodness.

So I guess I'm one of the weird ones.  I truly like Sirius and truly 
like Snape *and* truly like Harry...all in very different ways.  

But lest you all think I like *everybody*, I really don't like Luna 
at all!  [ducks]


Kneasy:
> When the Anti-Snape Alliance flail away, castigating him for the 
> way he treats Harry and Neville, nurses his grudges against James 
> and Sirius, they're really missing the point. We know all that. 
> It's not news - it's canon. For Snape-aholics the nub of the 
> question is - why? What is the back-story, what are Snape's 
> motivations? 
> 
> When the ASA over-simplify (IMO) with "he hates Harry, James, 
> Sirius and abuses kids - away  with him," they're possibly ignoring 
> something that could be central to the plot. He's probably the most 
> three-dimensional character in the  books, certainly IMO the best 
> written, he's believable in a way that say, DD isn't. This is why 
> he provokes so much reaction. The counter-reaction generally 
> doesn't claim Snape to be nice but responds in terms of comparing 
> him with memories of RL teachers and trying to explain why Snape 
> could be behaving in this way.


SSSusan:
And I can truly like the character of Snape and STILL join in with 
what you'd call ASA-bashing sometimes.  I don't think it's fair to 
say I'm missing the point (and perhaps you're not).  But in defense 
of how I have argued before, I'd say that "trying to explain why 
Snape could be behaving in this way" DOESN'T mean I'm necessarily 
doing anything different than what the Snape-aholics are doing in 
asking "Why?  What is the back-story, what are Snape's motivations?"  
In my mind, it's ALL an attempt to figure that out; it's just that I 
might do more complaining about Severus along the way.  I'm not 
an "away with him" person, though, so perhaps again I'm not fitting 
neatly into these two camps....


Kneasy:
> Is he acting or at least exaggerating, in his attitude towards 
> Harry? Quite possible. Why does DD trust him so completely? Why has 
> no-one complained about his teaching methods? Why did he leave 
> Voldy and the DEs yet still be able to remain on good terms with 
> Malfoy *and* perform some critical and dangerous yet still 
> specified anti-Voldy missions? We don't know, and it's highly 
> likely that when we do get the answers it still won't make Snape a 
> pleasant person, but it might make him understandable.
<snip>
> Snape has been a central figure in nearly book, yet how much do we 
> really know about him? Not much - all we see is the surface; 
> underneath that it should get a lot more interesting. Now you may 
> not agree....
<snip>
> That, I think, is what attracts the Snape-aholics. We want to know 
> more.


SSSusan:
Exactly!  I *do* agree with this.  This is all what I'm saying, I 
think.  By your definitions & examples, I fit into the Snape-aholic 
camp because I want to know more...desperately!  I sit up straighter 
when I hit a chapter w/ Severus in it.  But yet I engage in what you 
would possibly call ASA behavior, too, at times.  I don't think it 
has to be an either/or.  It would only be an either/or if the Snape-
aholics were Snape-apologists.

SIRIUSLY SNAPEY Susan