Ginny and the entrancing Veil

[ohneill_2001]

No: HPFGUIDX 107462

 
> > 
> > Now Cory:
> > 
> > I don't know whether young TR saw MM's death or not, but for 
> > purposes of your argument, I would argue that it does not matter.
> > 
> > The person who possessed Ginny (if "person" is the right word), 
was 
> > not just the 16-year-old Riddle.  It was the memory of Riddle's 
16-
> > year-old self, but it was also a person that knew Riddle / 
> > Voldemort's future, including the killing of Harry's parents and 
> > his demise by Harry.  Thus, if we are theorizing that Ginny was 
> > mesmerized by the veil because of her possession by Riddle, it 
> > should not matter whether Riddle saw MM's death.  She could have 
> > just as easily have been tainted by the memory of the countless 
> > other deaths that Riddle / Voldemort caused throughout his life.
> 
> 
> dcgmck again:
> 
> Hm... I see what you're saying.  In fact, if Ginny's possession had 
> had the effect I initially suggested, she shouldn't have had any 
> trouble seeing the threstrals.

Cory again:

Perhaps, although this assumes that being entranced by the veil and 
seeing the thestrals are triggered by *exactly* the same thing, which 
is not necessarily true.  We know that seeing the thestrals is 
triggered by *seeing* death.  It is possible that entrancement by the 
veil results from something else relating to death, other than 
physically seeing it.

In other words -- maybe being "tainted" by her possession by Riddle 
does not constitute "seeing" death (thus, she can't see the 
thestrals), but still has the effect of causing her to be mesmerized 
by the veil.

dcgmck again:
  
> 
> Still, I don't think the memory of Riddle knew any more of what his 
> future self had done than what Ginny told him in the diary before 
> Harry started communicating with him.  Of course, then Riddle 
> possessed Ginny again...  OK.  But Harry knew even less than Ginny 
> did in his second year at Hogwarts.  OK, I'm confused again.  How 
> would the memory have learned enough to contaminate Ginny, unless 
it 
> was outside of the visible narrative line while at the Malfoy 
estate?

Cory again:

The more I think about this, the more I think I was wrong in my last 
post.  My initial thought was that, althought the diary was made by 
Riddle when he was 16, it somehow "grew" with Riddle/Voldemort as he 
matured, and therefore the Riddle that was in the diary had knowledge 
of everything that Voldemort was to become.  Upon further reflection 
(and having looked back at the chapter in COS where Riddle was 
talking to Harry in the Chamber), I think I might have been wrong 
about this.

--Cory