Harry's Justified Not to Trust (was Harry as Kreacher)

[Arya]

No: HPFGUIDX 100559

<dumbledore11214 at y...> wrote:
> > I don't sympathise with him [Snape] AT ALL for ending Occlumency lessons. No 
> > matter what Harry did to him , stakes were too high and he knew it.
> > 
> > Now, we may learn that Occlumency ended for some reasons unknown to 
> > us yet, that will be different story.(Like maybe Harry already 
> > learned it or something else).
> >  With the facts I have now, I want to slap Snape when I reread those 
> > pages.
> > 
Kneasy then asked:
> But I have to say, Alla, just what could Snape *do* when Harry won't cooperate?
> Imperio! him, perhaps?
> 
> Harry certainly won't listen to anything Snape has to say, no matter that
> it's what DD wants. School discipline may be used to govern actions, but
> directing thoughts is something else. If Harry won't practice, won't take 
> any notice of DD or Snape then the whole thing is a waste of time. Because
> basically it's all down to Harry -  he's the one that has to *learn* 
> Occlumency, no-one can force it on him. 
-------------

Arya:
To me, the clear answer here is that Snape could have not just instructed *what* to do 
(clear your mind) but *how* to do it (visualize a shinyhappyplace or something) and 
the *why* to do it (because Voldemort may want to feed you false visions and lead 
you to this DoM you're dreaming about so stop wondering about your dreams).  
There, that helps an awful lot in my opinion.  Especially the *why* of it.  I don't think 
*that* is too much to spill.  Sure Harry may want to know more but he'd still know 
enough to know he needed to avoid getting tricked by Voldemort.  
----------------

> Kneasy wrote:
> Not only that, Harry deliberately misleads Snape. He pretends that he is 
> trying, that he does want to master the subject, when in fact the opposite
> is true. He wants to know more about that corridor, the door and what's 
> behind it. 
--------------

Arya:
Harry, as I said above, has no motivation to learn this.  Hell--if anything, he sees how 
his scar connection saved Mr. W's life and so he needs to understand why, not only is 
the scar connection bad but, why is it *not a good* thing!

-----------

> Kneasy wrote:
> So  what if Voldy is strolling through his mind? It's irrelevant to Harry,
> Harry must be allowed to do what Harry wants to do. Anyone who tries
> to stop him is being unfair and unreasonable. Harry is into instant
> gratification and damn the consequences - they can always be blamed
> on someone else.
> 
> Harry really  isn't a very nice person in  this book, but so far as he's
> concerned he's being perfectly reasonable and it's all somebody else's
> fault. I can't agree.  Harry is directly culpable for the death of Sirius.
> Because he wouldn't listen to those in a position to know better.
------------------

Arya:
Those who know better?  Like who?!  Please, Harry has every reason to believe in OotP 
that he's got he, himself and and his wand to help him out.  (And ron and Hermione.)  
There was no teacher to help him out when Quirrell went after the stone (McG didn't 
believe him and DD was almost too late).  He almost got killed again by the next 
DADA teacher and had to do the dirty work in the CoS on his own, he's the one who 
saved his own life (and Sirius's and Hermione's) with the Time-turning Patronus, he 
was left to stumble through the TWT on his own with the only professor reallly 
helping him along being the one who wanted to kill him.  I think you see where I am 
going--can you honestly say Harry has any real basis for trusting that those around 
him are doing everything they need to and that he can just sit back and follow along 
like an obedient little boy?  No--if he'd done that all along, Voldemort would have 
been back and IMMORTAL for about four years now, Ginny would have been left to 
die,  three people would be soulless creatures and let's face it, the HPverse would be 
a bit different.  It's all a plot device yes, but you see, Harry has every right to believe 
*he* has to make his own decisions.  He has every right to feel he should not take 
anyone's advice or instruction as gospel or truth.  He's an orphan who's never had any 
adult figure to rely on and now you say he's not a nice person because he can't shirk 
off the independent survival skills he had to cultivate in order to cope through life???  
No way.  Harry is justified, IMO.  In fact, since everyone and anyone knows Harry's life 
story (especially the teachers) they are guilty of even more for not trying to 
understand how Harry is a bit different than a normal, more trusting teen.  

Just my thoughts, 
Arya