Who is the adult (Was: Who's to blame for Occlumency?)

[Brenda]

No: HPFGUIDX 100766

I have been reading this thread with great enthusiasm (as I myself 
posted a very long message on similar issue), however, it seems to me 
that every post is coming to the same conclusion now.

Harry is a teenager with a burden much heavier than a normal adult 
can handle. But he still is a teenager, so he makes the same mistakes 
that teenagers make as part of their growing-up phase.

Snape is an adult with traumatizing past. He had been tormented and 
abused as a child, and he will bear that scar for a very long time.

True, according to Hunter & Kilstrom's prospective-designed studies 
on the issue of inter-generational transmission, only 18% of "abused" 
became "abuser" ("Breaking the cycle in abusive families." American 
Journal of Psychiatry. 1979 Oct;136(10):1320-2). Hunter & Kilstrom 
also discuss the escape-mechanisms employed by the remaining 82% - 
they are:

" - reliance on a broad network of resources
- a degree of self-differentiation
- an attitude of realistic optimism
- and the ability to marshall extra resources "
(also from the Abstract of "Breaking the cycle in abusive families")

And I cannot place Snape under these categories, except for 
the 'degree of self-differentiation' one (which I interpret as 
posessing competence and superior problem-solving ability). Maybe 
Snape turned to Dark Arts in order to cope with his abuse? My PSY100 
notes also state that most of seriously-abused children who developed 
resiliency tend to be attractive females - Snape?!?! Now THAT is a 
scary thought (no offence to Alan Rickman, who portrays much more 
attractive Snape than the books IMO)

>>> Oryomai: It's well established that Severus cannot grow up.  He 
needs a psychiatrist and some therapy.  Look at his situation, he was 
tormented by people in his youth and he can't get over it -- happens 
to lots of people. <<<

YEs, Snape needs to grow up, he's not the weak, tormented abused 
child anymore. Or is he? This is one of the most fundamental 
attributes to the character Snape, and I cannot blame him for his 
*certain* actions (especially the ones involving the Occlumency 
lessons). Just like how I don't blame HArry for feeling that no one 
can save the world except for him. But I like Snape much better, so 
I'm willing to defend him more than defending HArry ;P. 

>>> Oryomai: Why does everyone underestimate teenagers?  Why does the 
fact that Harry's 15 give him the right to act like a little berk?  
<snip> But for some reason, every time Harry does something bad, 
it's "Harry is 15!  Severus isn't 15!"  What does age have to do with 
it?  Age is no excuse AT ALL.  Especially when you know what Harry 
knows.  Severus knows too, but isn't Harry our hero?  (That be 
sarcasm...I'm not a big Harry fan at all...) <<<

I completely agree with you. Especially since Harry WANTED to be 
treated like an adult so badly. And I am not a big Harry fan either, 
he's too obssessed with being righteous and heroic.

>>> Oryomai: Actually, I believe we have yet to meet a real adult in 
the HP series. <<<

I'd say Dumbledore is a real adult? He's willing to give people 
second chance, doesn't get winded up in personal emotion too much, 
knows when someone is lying to him and persuades them to be 
truthful... And I don't think DD was *stupid* in telling HArry about 
the prophecy at the end of OoP (I believe Alla said "Dumbledore's 
stupidity" in earlier post? It made me jump out of my seat). As I 
elaborated in my earlier post (called "Who's to Blame for Sirius' 
Death"), I think VM would have penetrated HArry's mind and extract 
the content of prophecy if DD had told him before.  At least, this 
way, VM still hasn't acquired the "stealth weapon".

I can put McGonagall in this list as well, she has my utmost 
respect. 'It turns the other way' hahaha.

Who knows, maybe Nicholas Flamel is mature as well, after all, he's 
had more than 600 years to mature!


Brenda, who thought she was getting real tired of "Who is the adult" 
debate and yet put more into it.