Sirius revisited

[snow15145]

No: HPFGUIDX 103770

Kneasy:
>snipped<
Nurture or nature? Do bloodlines define
the person in the Potterverse, or is it up-bringing? Or both?

Snow:
I have to say that this particular line brought to mind two specific 
individuals. One is Harry and the other is Voldemort. There 
relationship as far as upbringing is quite similar as are there 
bloodlines and yet differences
 "It is our choices
"

Kneasy:
2. Sirius may not be able to divulge the Potters hiding place
(presumably that location vanished from his mind when handing over his
duties), but he does know who the new SK is. He must, otherwise he
can't contact the Potters when necessary.

Snow:
Two points two this statement actually. The first would be that I 
would have to trust that Peter had actually been made SK according to 
Sirius' request. The second is more of a question, why would you feel 
that Sirius needs to contact or has contact with the Potters? Sirius 
said GOF pg. 365 " The night they died, I'd arranged to check on 
Peter
" Sirius arranged previously to check on Peter. 

Kneasy:
3. Sirius would last about 5 minutes under intensive Voldy pressure.
Not only is Voldy one of the two most powerful wizards in the world
with a whole range of 'persuasive' spells at his finger-tips, he's 
also
a mind-reader of note. And there's only two recorded Occlumency adepts
in the books - expecting Sirius to be another is asking a bit too much
IMO.

Snow:
I think you might be wrong here Kneasy. Sirius wouldn't have lasted a 
minute with Voldemort because when Voldy gave him the ultimatum of 
tell or be killed he would have died. 

Kneasy:
Then the aftermath. More strokes of Black genius. He arrives at the
house. As the supposed SK he's the prime suspect for the betrayal of
the Potters. Does he proclaim his innocence? No. Just this one time, 
at
a moment when his penchant for excuses might actually do him some 
good,
he keeps his mouth shut. Why? >snip<

Snow:
Possibly because his very best friend is lying in rubble and Sirius 
feels it is all his fault because he felt guilty (as in the Shrieking 
Shack) of Indirectly betraying his friend.

Kneasy:
Instead he goes off after Peter. To kill him. There's just one person
who could clear him - and that's the one he tries to kill. Now if I
had a suspicious nature I'd wonder at that. Clearing away loose ends,
perhaps? Making sure there's nobody left to contradict his tale? How
convenient. And no trial. Why not? Fear of what he might say in court?
He can say nothing that would harm the 'good' side, but he could
conceivably let the cat out of the bag where Voldy supporters are
concerned. So he's quickly hustled off to the slammer where he sits 
for
12 years.

Snow:
You're right. How dare Sirius care about his dead friends more than 
himself and his own hide at this point. 
No trial you say, good point I say. Pretend for a moment that Sirius 
is innocent
what would you say then to the who's afraid of Sirius 
talking too much? 

Kneasy:
I've covered his 'escape' from Azkaban in some detail in post 79808, 
no
need to go through it all again - suffice it to say that his story is
full of holes and a good case can be made for his 'escape' being the
result of a deliberate conspiracy (probably by Fudge). The only
question is whether or not Sirius was a knowing participant in the 
plan
or an unwitting catspaw. Once again he has one aim. Kill Peter. After
12 years of sitting around, claiming that it was only the knowledge
that he was innocent that kept him sane, his preferred first action is
to kill the one person who could actually *prove* his innocence. Some
people never learn.

Snow:
I do honestly agree with you here. This scene in anyone's eyes should 
certainly look like a set-up, but by whom?

Kneasy:
>Snipped<
The Godfather bit I consider to be a red
herring. In the UK 'Godfather' is a purely symbolic title and confers
no rights nor places responsibilities/obligations on the recipient. Of
course, Godfather does have another meaning, ask Mario Puzo.

Snow:
Have to correct you a bit here. POA pg. 379 "Well
 your parents 
appointed me your guardian," said Black stiffly. "Guardian" is much 
more than just a Godfather. 

Kneasy:
Would you hand a child over to such a person? No - and neither will 
DD.
He's not to be trusted with the care of someone as critical to DD's
plan as Harry is.

Snow:
Now, I am one of your biggest allies! It all comes back to DD and his 
ultimate plan. This still doesn't make it necessary to have an ESE 
Sirius.

Snow