JKR Chat "The Crucial and Central Question"

[cubfanbudwoman]

No: HPFGUIDX 92214

Susan, originally:
> > I do NOT agree with you here, Kneasy.  I agree that he rushed 
> > into things w/o fully thinking through the potential consequences 
> > and without a well-thought-out plan of action.  But he WAS 
> > choosing!  Even if DD set up the scenario(s) ...Harry was still 
> > choosing whether to act or not.  He could have sat on his ass & 
> > said, "Well, *I'M* not gonna be the one who goes after the 
> > Stone!  I'm just a kid!"  Just because it was done with 
> > adolescent enthusiasm and without much thought as to how he would 
> > handle what he might encounter, he was still CHOOSING **and** 
> > choosing because he wanted to STOP THE EVIL GUY.  How is that 
> > not choosing his side?
> > 

Kneasy:
> Oh, and fair warning, I see possible problems with semantics and the
> definitions of words when employed in differing usages looming. 

Susan:
Semantics, schmemantics.  Let's have at it!

Kneasy:
> Let's clear one thing out of the way first; if he did make a speech 
> about only being a kid and so not about to go after the Stone, 
> would that put him on the side of evil? No, as I'm sure you'd 
> agree. As a corollary just because he does go after the Stone it 
> does not guarantee that it is an expression of a commitment to a 
> conscious decision to fight evil in the same way as, say, DD has 
> made an assumed commitment to fight against it.

Susan:
I'm absolutely with you on the first.  His saying "I'm just a kid" 
would NOT necessarily mean he on the side of Evil.  More than likely 
it would mean he simply had a healthy, normal dose of fear & 
reluctance to get involved.  BUT--and this is a big but for me--Harry 
ISN'T reluctant to get involved.  Look at that "I'M going after it" 
speech in SS/PS again.  He IS choosing, and his reasons are 
presented.  It IS him choosing to work against the evil Voldy & 
thought-to-be-evil Snape.

Kneasy:
> If as you suggest, it was all set up by DD (and I don't necessarily 
> disagree with you) it adds weight to my contention that his side 
> was chosen for him. DD sets the scene, winds up Harry like a 
> clockwork  mouse, and off he goes, doing what DD wants him to do. 
> Same in CoS. <snips>  Nor do I believe that he couldn't find out 
> who spelled the Goblet of Fire. I'm damn certain he knew. Just as 
> he knew that Crouch! Moody was a fake. 
> 
> DD shuffles things around until Harry's options are reduced
> to a minimum. Harry is on rails and running on DD's timetable. His 
> choices are more-or-less non-existent and DD sits back and monitors 
> his progress.

Susan:
His choices are "reduced TO A MINIMUM", but they're still CHOICES.  
In SS/PS, I agree DD is really setting things up--I suspect as a 
test, to see what kind of wizarding skills & what kind of character 
Harry has.  Beyond that, in CoS, PoA & GoF, I don't think DD is 
pulling the strings as much.  He found out a lot about Harry in 
SS/PS.  I believe DD sets the FRAMEWORK--yes, sets the scene, as you 
say--but it's still HARRY'S CHOICE.  He could hit the point where he 
says, "Screw this.  I'm tired of it!" and walk away.  I doubt that he 
will because from what we've seen it's not in his character to do 
so.  He still has the choice, though.

Kneasy:
<A little removed from chronological order...> 
> How plausible is [all this] from someone supposedly with Harry's 
> best interests as his main concern?  <snip>  Harry didn't know it, 
> but he was being trained, both in his magical ability and his 
> reaction to situations.

Susan:
I would say he DOES have his best interests at heart.  Yes, DD is 
grooming Harry to make the BIG CHOICE later on, once he knows the 
prophecy.  And what will Harry NEED if he chooses to face those 
monstrous challenges?  Lots of skills, practice under fire, 
confidence in his fight for the GOOD side.  If DD is setting things 
up--and you think he is a touch more than I do--he's doing so in an 
effort to train Harry up.  

Kneasy:
> But now, at the end of OoP, he learns of the Prophecy and begins to 
> realise that his independence has been a fiction. He has been 
> assigned as Voldy's enemy from day one. His parents were not just 
> unfortunate casualties in a war, it was a targeted action and he 
> was the target. Worse, he is set up as the saviour of the WW. 

Susan:
Not a fiction.  His burden--his CHOICE--*is* heavier than anyone 
else's, but how is that DD's doing?  That's just the facts of life 
for Harry!  DD has been trying to help him prepare for this news.  
BUT IN THE END it WILL still be Harry's choice whether to "do his 
part".  He could rebel, just as he could have rebelled or declined 
all along.  DD is making it less LIKELY, because DD of course wants 
Harry to defeat Voldy.  But I think Harry shows us in SS/PS--shortly 
after he's found out he's a wizard and Voldy killed his parents--that 
it's IN HIM already to fight.  Yes, he's tired; yes, he's angry that 
it's he who has to do it; but he has CHOSEN to fight all along.  

So maybe that IS all semantics over the word "choice"??  For you it 
seems to mean limited options due to behind-the-scenes orchestrations 
of a puppetmaster.  For me it comes down to there being a BIT of a 
choice even in a limited-choice situation.

Siriusly Snapey Susan