Evaluating Snape (was: Re: Lupin's resentment )

[cubfanbudwoman]

No: HPFGUIDX 94162

{Silverthorne}
> By the same token, he [Snape] is not physically abusive--other 
> then Neville the students are not affected overly much by Snape's 
> words other then having a distinct dislike for him. And although 
> you may disagree, compared to what Umbridge does to the students, 
> an acid tongue is minor indeed. 

Susan:
> Stepping in to disagree just a wee bit here.  You are correct that 
> Snape does not appear to physically abuse his students.  However, 
> I would argue that what he does to Neville borders on bullying 
> and, more importantly, that what he does w/ Harry is something 
> different altogether than verbal abuse or physical abuse.  
> 
> Let's call it GRADE ABUSE.   
 
Carol:
> In one instance, it's partly Hermione's fault. There's no other 
> grade to give him. The apparent pleasure in giving Harry a zero 
> may be psychological abuse, though that's stretching it a bit, but 
> the grade isn't grade abuse. 
> 
> One more thing, and I know this is just my opinion, not canon: I 
> don't think the lesson Snape is teaching Harry in most of these 
> instances is that life is hard but that *you must follow 
> directions*. And why single out Harry to explain why his potion 
> went wrong, and not Goyle, whose potion nearly set the classroom 
> on fire? Because it's Harry who will need to use these potions....

SUSAN AGAIN:
Yup, yup, yup, I seem to be guilty of EXTRAPOLATING to a degree that 
was inappropriate on the grades.  In skimming through the books last 
evening, it became apparent that, if anything, it was "Points Abuse" 
even more than "Grade Abuse" that was coloring my impressions. :-) 
Okay, for grins, I'll set out briefly what I found on this *general* 
topic, expanding it to the wider area of Snape's treatment of Harry 
& the Gryffindors.

SORCERER'S STONE:
Neville messed up his potion and Snape said:
"You--Potter--why didn't you tell him not to add the quills?  
Thought he'd make you look good if he got it wrong, did you?  That's 
another point you've lost for Gryffindor."  [US Scholastic hardback, 
p. 139]

"Library books are not to be taken outside the school," said 
Snape.  "Give it to me.  Five points from Gryffindor."
"He's just made that rule up," Harry muttered angrily.... [US, p. 
182]

"Potions lessons were turning into a sort of weekly torture, Snape 
was so horrible to Harry."  [US, p. 221]

CHAMBER OF SECRETS:
"Professor Severus Snape was Harry's least favorite teacher.  Harry 
also happened to be Snape's least favorite student.  Cruel, 
sarcastic, and disliked by everybody except the students from his 
own house (Slytherin)...." [US, p. 77]

[The lesson where Harry's to create a diversion for 
Hermione.]  "Snape prowled through the fumes, making waspish remarks 
about the Gryffindors' work while the Slytherins sniggered 
appreciatively. Draco Malfoy, who was Snape's favorite student, kept 
flickering puffer-fish eyes at Ron and Harry, who knew that if they 
retaliated they would get detention faster than you could 
say 'Unfair.'" [US, p. 186]  [Harry **was** breaking the rules in 
this lesson!]

PRISONER OF AZKABAN:
Snape is filling in for Lupin in DADA.  Harry is late & justifiably 
loses 10 points.  A series of points are taken for 1) Harry not 
sitting down; 2) Harry asking what's wrong w/ Lupin; 3) Hermione 
blurting out an answer about werewolves after Snape both ignores her 
hand *and* having said "Anyone [know the difference]?"  Clearly 
Hermione did know, but he wouldn't allow her to answer, then he took 
points for her knowing.  Ron also received detention for pointing 
out this last.  [US, pp. 170-172]

Mel said previously that:
"In *every single* one of those lessons (even the one in which SNAPE 
HIMSELF breaks Harry's sample flask) Harry has screwed up his potion 
due to carelessness, inattentiveness or nosiness."  I would agree 
that certainly Harry is to blame sometimes, but I would also provide 
this:

"They had Potions that afternoon, which was an unqualified 
disaster.  Try as Harry might, he couldn't get his Confusing 
Concoction to thicken, and Snape, standing watch with an air of 
vindictive pleasure, scribbled something that looked suspiciously 
like a zero onto his notes before moving away."  [US, p. 318]  No, 
we don't KNOW he gave a zero, but we do see that Harry was trying 
not to mess up.

GOBLET OF FIRE:
"...Snape--Harry's least favorite person at Hogwarts.  Harry's 
loathing of Snape was matched only by Snape's hatred of him, a 
hatred which had, if possible, intensified last year, when Harry had 
helped Sirius escape right under Snape's overlarge nose...." [US, p. 
175]

[Draco & Harry get into a pre-class fight over Draco's comments 
about Hermione & Ron.  BOTH fire spells which collide & wreak havoc 
on others--Hermione's teeth & Goyle's nose.]  After cruelly telling 
Hermione he saw no difference in her teeth, Snape says, "'Let's 
see,' he said, in his silkiest voice. 'Fifty points from Gryffindor 
and a detention each for Potter and Weasley." [US, pp. 298-300]

ORDER OF THE PHOENIX:
[First lesson of the year--a "difficult, fiddly potion" was 
assigned.  Harry's didn't look right, and neither did Ron's, 
Seamus's or Goyle's.]  "At Harry's cauldron, however, Snape stopped, 
looking down at Harry with a horrible smirk on his face.  'Potter, 
what is this supposed to be?'... [Harry replied, Snape asks if he 
can read, Harry sees his error.]... "'I forgot the hellebore....' 
'I know you did, Potter, which means that this mess is utterly 
worthless.  Evanesco.'  ...His potion had been no worse than 
Ron's...or Neville's...yet it was he, Harry, who would be receiving 
zero marks for the day's work. ...'That was really unfair,' said 
Hermione consolingly.... 'Your potion wasn't nearly as bad as 
Goyle's, when he put it in his flagon the whole thing shattered and 
set his robes on fire.'" [US, pp. 233-235]

[Harry receives a "D" on his homework. Then that day's new lesson is 
part one of Strengthening Solution.]  "Determined not to give Snape 
an excuse to fail him this lesson, Harry read & reread every line of 
the instructions on the blackboard at least three times before 
acting on them." [In his own assessment, it wasn't perfect but still 
good.  He delivered a flagon to Snape.  Again, I point out that he 
*is* trying.] [US, pp. 309-310]

[Part 2 of Strengthening Solution.  Harry allows himself to be 
distracted by Umbridge's questioning of Snape and his potion begins 
to go bad.]  "'No marks again, then, Potter,' said Snape 
maliciously, emptying Harry's cauldron with a wave of his 
hand.  'You will write me an essay on the correct composition of 
thie potion, indicating how & why you went wrong....'" [US, pp. 
364]  [I understand the assignment at the end, but no points for 
part one? taking the potion away before he was done? *Does he do 
this to anyone else?*]

[Malfoy baits the Gryffindor crew over Quidditch, then insults 
Neville's parents.  Neville tries to attack, and Harry & Ron 
**stop** him.]  "'Fighting, Potter, Weasley, Longbottom?' Snape said 
in his cold, sneering voice. 'Ten points from Gryffindor.'" [US, pp. 
361-362]  

[Snape, post-Occlumency ending, ignores Harry in class.  This helps 
Harry, who was pleased w/ his Invigoration Draught.]  "At the end of 
the lesson he scooped some of the potion into a flask, corked it, 
and took it up to Snape's desk for marking, feeling that he might at 
last have scraped an E.  He has just turned away when he heard a 
smashing noise....  His potion sample lay in pieces on the floor, 
and Snape was surveying him with a look of gloating 
pleasure.  'Whoops,' he said softly.  'Another zero, then, 
Potter....'" [US, pp. 660-661]

I'm not trying to pick any fights here.  I just wanted to present 
what I found in my perusal of the books.  Clearly I was wrong about 
*routine* zeros, at least from what I found here.  On the other 
hand, I will argue to the death, as a former teacher, that Snape's 
teaching methods suck!  That last example, in particular, show a 
level of immaturity on Snape's part which is truly appalling.  I'll 
even grant that *sometimes* Snape's antics are designed to get Harry 
to **pay attention** to important things, but a good teacher: 1) 
recognizes that the methods which are effective with one student 
aren't always effective with another [and what he's doing w/ Harry  
*don't* seem to be working to help him learn]; and 2) does not allow 
himself/herself to engage in such ridiculous levels of favoritism.

Just my $.02.

Siriusly Snapey Susan