Harry's questions ... parents - Dangerous Questions

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 117433


--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, Magda Grantwich
<mgrantwich at y...> wrote:
> --- Steve <bboyminn at y...> wrote:
> 
> > When ever this comes up, I bring up the same point. I really don't
> > think people are giving enough weight to the fact that Harry was
> > raised in an abusive and oppressive household. Yes, people
> > acknowledge that, but I don't think they make enough of an effort 
> > to look at the underlying psychology. 
> > 
> > Living in a household like this is like living with an armed bomb
> > that has a hair-trigger; ...
> > 
> > An abusive household is also irrational, there is no logic or
> > reason to what sets off the abuser. ...
> >
> > Steve/bboyminn (was bboy_mn)
> 
> The Dursleys are nobody's nominees for "Guardians of the Year" but
> they're not abusive in the sense that Steve refers to above.  ...
> 

bboyminn:

First, and I thought it was clear, I was speaking of abusive
situations in general. In a sense, I wasn't defining Harry's
circumstances specifically, I was defining a catagory of circumstance.
A catagory in which I believe Harry falls, althought I admit he
doesn't fall at the most extreme end of that catagory.

Harry isn't abuse? So, Petunia attempting to hit him in the head with
a frying pan doesn't count as a sign of abuse, apparently because she
missed. That fact that she has him put in a full days work, and fed
him only a couple pieces of toast early in the day, and a small piece
of cheeze and some stale bread at the end of the day would be regarded
as sufficient food. Vernon threatened to knock the stuffing out of
Harry and clearly meant it. Dudley is referred to as frequently using
Harry as his favorite punching bag, not to mention kicking Harry on
occassion, as well as engaging in other physical abuse. Harry is
forced to live in a closet despite the presents of a spare bedroom.
Harry talks about having had to go without food for significant
periods of time as punishment. Many times Vernon raises his hand in
threat of physical punishment that I think we can reasonable assume
implies actual occurances of physical punishment of the page.  

If nothing else, even in the unlikely event that Vernon doesn't
physically punish him in ways that are out of proportion to what Harry
may have done, there is the element of psychological abuse. Vernon
overbearing unreasonable anger can create a hostile, intimidating,
oppressive, and threatening environment. Harry is denied food, denied
friends; his presents is suppressed and oppressed in every way. These
are classic ploys by abusers to keep their victim as helpless,
dependant, vulnerable, isolated, and made to feel as worthless as
possible.

>Magda continues:
>
> I don't think Harry would qualify as an "abused child" in any legal
> or clinical sense of the word in the backstory of the series. He 
> was definitely a neglected child, and that is bad enough. Not until
> locked him in his room with not enough food everyday did he become 
> an abused child (in COS).  
> 
> Magda


bboyminn:

Oh please, in this day and age, and even in the early and middle
1990's when the story takes place, kids are considered abused and
neglected for far less than the Dursleys have done. In fact, if child
protection/social services found out about the Dursleys, they would
have a field day. 

So again, the points I made about abuse were a generalization used to
illustrate how and why abused kids act the way they do. While the
illustration referred to the most extreme cases, I think it validly
illustrates and explains Harry's case; in other words, Harry falls
into that catagory.

However, all that said, I agree with Del, who posted earlier in this
thread, Harry is growning up and in the process is growing more
defiant of the Dursley authority. In fact I would say with confidence
that as of OotP, the Dursley have very little affect on or control
over Harry. In the last few years Harry as faced far worse threads
than Dudley or Uncle Vernon. At this stage the Dursleys are starting
to look pretty pathetic to him, and clearly, he's not even remotely
intimidated by Dudley anymore. 

While Harry can never fully escape the effects of his early life, he
has none the less become a strong, capable, self-determined, confident
individual. To echo Del, even in my book, Harry has run out of
excuses. He's not a shy little boy anymore, and I think the lose of
Sirius is going to motivate Harry to claim the answers to all those
questions he now realizes he should have asked. 

As to why Harry came out of it as well as he did, I think several
things come into play. First, Harry is a wizard, and wizards in
general are extremely resilient people. Harry was loved during a very
early and critical stage of his life. Harry is extremely intelligent,
and as an example, as abusive as Dudley may have been to Harry, Harry
is able to out smart him ...and out run him. Harry is an extremely
strong person, he as strength of will and strength of character. And
among other things, he's stubborn as a mule. I think that's one reason
Ron and Harry get along so well, they are both stubborn and
bull-headed. This give Harry additional strength at resisting the
oppression of the Dursleys. There relationship has become a /war/ that
Harry is fiercely determined to win; he will never let them get him
down. He will never let them say he is worthless, because he's not,
even if he doesn't know why he's not.

In addition, I think Harry, deep down, carries some traces of his
earlier good life, and small and distant as they are, they help
sustain him. Although it's not shown clearly, it's also possible that
Harry, especially in his early life, has a rich fantasy life filled
with dreams of wizards, dragons, and giants on flying motorcycles that
give him an escape for the oppression of his external life.

It was just a thought.

Steve/bboyminn (was bboy_mn)