Harry : compassion vs saving-people thing

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 114847


--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "delwynmarch" 
<delwynmarch at y...> wrote:
> 
> I've been thinking about that one for a while.
> 
> There seems to be a general agreement that Harry is very
> compassionate. That has always troubled me, because I just don't 
see
> that. What I see is what Hermione saw : Harry has a saving people 
thing.


Alla:
Dell, could you please, please, tell me what your definition of 
compassion is? I honestly want to know. As some people on the list 
know I start getting frustrated when I don't understand where other 
person is coming from and I often don't understand where you are 
coming from. So, please help me. I am not being sarcastic.

To me desire to save people is ALWAYS a good thing and often equals 
compassion.


Before I start commenting on your examples, I have ageneral comment 
to make. In all of them, you make  a distinction that Harry does not 
care first and then cares when he thinks that person is dying. But 
everything is happening fast in those situations. I don't think 
Harry really has time to make the distinction in his mind.

  

Del:

> Let's take a few examples.
> 
> In PS/SS, Harry doesn't care much when Hermione breaks down after
> hearing Ron's hurtful comment about her. She doesn't show up for 
the
> Halloween Feast, but so what ? He knows she's crying in the 
toilets,
> but he doesn't care about going to get her and making her come to 
the
> Feast. But then suddenly she's in danger of being killed by the 
Troll,
> and *then* he cares.


Alla:


Harry only HEARS about Parvati telling Lavender "that Hermione was 
crying in the girls' bathroom and wanted to be left alone" - PS/SS, 
p.172, paperback, on their way to the Feast. When Hermione is absent 
from class, Harry does not know she i. She is not his close friend 
or even acquintance yet.

Why is he supposed to be worried?

So, on his way to the feast Harry hears that Hermione was crying and 
at the feast Quirrel tells about Hermione and Harry rushes to help.

Why is it not compassionate? Was he not supposed to help her?


Del:
> In CoS, Harry doesn't care much about Ginny looking pale, sick and
> troubled. She obviously wants to talk to someone, but Harry doesn't
> care about getting her in a quiet place and asking her what's
> bothering her. But then suddenly she's taken to the Chamber of
> Secrets, and *then* he cares. But what does he care about, 
exactly ?
> Does he care about Ron and Percy's obvious pain ? No. Does he care
> about Ginny's emotional well-being after the ordeal is over ? No. 
The
> *only* thing he cares about, and he tells us so, is that she might 
die.



Alla:

Same question. How do you know that Harry does not care about Ron 
and Percy's pain?

Was he not supposed to rush at Ginny's help? 


Del:

> Let's take another example in GoF. The Second Task. Harry gets to 
the
> Merpeople town, and finds the hostages. He then decides to wait to
> make sure they are all rescued. But *why* does he do that ? Does he
> care about the people who would get hurt if Cho, Hermione and
> Gabrielle died ? NO ! In fact, if he did think of them, he would
> realise that there's no way the hostages are going to be let to 
die if
> they are not rescued. DD made it very clear that he didn't want any
> player in the TWT to die, so why would he allow *innocent* people 
who
> never asked to be part of the show to die ?? But no Harry doesn't
> think about that, he's only obsessed with one thing, and once 
again he
> tells us so : "I don't want them to die !".



Alla:

Contradiction, Del. First you say that Harry does not care  about 
girls dying and then you cite his "I don't want them to die" Harry 
did not have much time to think  to figure out that girls are not 
really going to die and judges actually recognised that.

Besides, what do you mean Dumbledore does not want contestants and 
other participants to die? Of course, he does not, but it does not 
mean that they cannot. Remember  "the death toll mounted so high 
that the tournament was dsicontinued" - GoF, p.187, paperback.
Yes, I'd say it was pretty reasonable of Harry to think that girls 
faced REAL danger


Del:
> He doesn't want
> to end Sirius's pain, he wants to prevent him from dying.


Alla:

You lost me. I think Harry wants to do both.

 
> 

.
Del:
 
> What makes Harry save people is not compassion, it's his saving-
people
> complex, which not only is not based on compassion, but quite often
> goes against what compassion would recommend.
> 
> Just my opinion, of course.

Alla:

How does it go against what compassion would recommend?

I LOVE Harry's "saving people thing". Actually, I would simply call 
it being a hero, but that is just MY opinion, of course.