"Weak" Pettigrew (Re: What Pettigrew did at Godric's Hollow)

[Brenda M.]

No: HPFGUIDX 111751

> mhbobbin: The contrast between how Pettigrew is described and his 
> supposed actions is very strange. McGonagall describes Pettigrew 
> as "hopeless at duelling". Yet he supposedly got the better of a 
> more clever wizard, Sirius. And yet the characters never question 
> this contrast. Sirius dismisses Pettigrew getting the better of him 
> in that duel by having his wand behind his back. If Pettigrew has 
> his wand behind his back, followed by an explosion, how does Sirius 
> know it was Pettigrew? Why wouldn't Sirius have anticipated that 
> Pettigrew would have his wand behind his back? He was, after all, 
> corned.

Bren now:

I once thought of the possibility where Peter used Voldemort's wand 
for killing 13 people that day. After all, wands choose the wizards 
and Voldemort's was a very powerful one. Also IIRC JKR said in a 
recent interview that Peter kept VM's wand when in hiding, correct? 
But then I thought, well if Peter used VM's wand to kill those 
people, then Harry would have seen their 'ghosts' in the Riddle's 
graveyard...

Then Theotokos gave me an idea. He wrote:
> Maybe it wasn't a curse to kill 12 people but a spell to blow up 
> the street giving Wormtail access to the sewers? The concrete and 
> blown gas lines killed the pedestrians as a result.

After all, the description has it "explosion" and "blowing up the 
street", not "streets full of green light". And it seems that during 
Priori Incantatum, only Voldemort's AK victims appeared from his 
wand, because AK was the spell cast when the connection was made 
between wands. If Priori Incantatum was the reverse spell effect for 
every spell VM has performed, we would have seen his AK, Crucio-ed, 
Imperio-ed and other victims.

Now I'm convinced that Peter used Voldemort's wand for duelling 
Sirius the day he was arrested, and Harry doesn't see the 13 victims 
during Priori Incantatum because Peter didn't use AK curse to kill 
them.


>> mhbobbin: And Sirius never credits that Pettigrew learned how to 
> transform into a rat. Sure, his friends helped him. But few
> wizards, apparently, can do this.

Bren: Well if you were one of the friends who helped him transform 
into a rat... would you be so quick to give him credit for that? And 
I imagine it took him many trials (and many countless more "How thick 
can you get?" comments from Sirius and James).

As for the very small number of Registered Animagi in WW -- some 
think that one reason is not that it is such a rare talent, but 
because they have to be so closely monitored by the Ministry, and 
they may easily become suspects, thus it is not very desired, etc etc.


>> mhbobbin: The rat is not all that he seems. It's hard 
> to reconcile poor weak Peter Pettigrew with a wizard who was a 
> traitor to one his best friends for about a year -- clever enough
> that DD, James, Sirius and Lupin never suspected him <<
> [then mhbobbin later]
> And I still think there must be important backstory to the reasons 
that Remus and Sirius suspected each other of being the Spy.
> Maybe it was just Default--it can't be Peter so it must be you.
> But maybe Remus--and DD---accepted Sirius' guilt because of what 
they knew he was capable of. 
> And that may bring us right back to the episode in school where he 
tricked Snape in the infamous Whomping Willow episode.
> If that is the case, then what had Remus done that made Sirius 
suspect him of being the Spy? <<<

Bren:

Lol, don't know about you, but I have far less difficulty believing 
in ESE!Lupin here than Peter clever enough to fool them all for a 
year! At least Lupin has the intelligence to pull it off! And Lupin
appears to be Occlumens/Legilimens himself. If Peter had been indeed 
passing secrets to Voldemort for a year, I don't think he would do so 
great with DD's intense staring behind semi-moon spectacles?

I think that was precisely why James and Sirius suspected Remus of 
being the Spy -- that he really was the spy, but Peter just cracked 
under the pressure and handed the Potters. And if you are the guilty 
party, you naturally point finger at someone else eh?

As for the infamous Whomping Willow episode -- while it proves how 
devious Sirius can be, it is whole different story to accept this 
prank as a key to understand why the extremely loyal Sirius would 
betraye his best friend.

 
> mhbobbin: I still think that there was another wizard on the scene, 
> possibly Fudge. But the idea that Pettigrew was looking to escape 
> and blew up the street to get where he was going--what did he care 
> about innocent bystanders--is a plausible explanation.

Oy, that Fudge. Guilty as charged!!


> It's been written before but I think it's valid to repeat--was the 
> Laughter due to a Cheering Charm?  Throughout PoA, the kids are 
learning Cheering Charms- it's said that overstressed Hermione could 
> use one, and Harry overdoes one on Ron so that Ron must be taken 
away to quiet down before he can finish the exam. Why learn Cheering 
> Charms? Perhaps the mystery of the hysterical laughter in the 
Sirius / Pettigrew duel.  And we haven't seen a Cheering Charm since 
> PoA. 

Bren: There was a thread a while ago on Why Sirius Laughed. If I can 
remember what was said...

- Sirius simply couldn't believe what was happening to him, he 
realized out the dimwitted Peter had outsmarted Sirius big time. How 
could *anyone* think he would betray James? He found it very absurd.
- Sirius thought Peter 'accidently' blew himself up, and found it 
very hilarious.

The possible use of Cheering Charm was mentioned as well, but the 
most strong argument was that Sirius couldn't believe it. Someone 
mentioned how his/her friend was once wrongly accused by the Chicago 
Police, and all he did was to hysterically laugh (which did not look 
good to the police, the person said).


Brenda