DoubleAgent!Lupin

[Cathy Drolet]

No: HPFGUIDX 137374

Pippin:
But Harry makes it quite clear that he's not interested in talking to
Scrimgeour while Stan Shunpike is in jail. If R.S. had a prominent
DE capture to brag about, why care about Shunpike? Fenrir is 
notorious, he's threatened countless people, according to Lupin. 

And the stupefied Death Eater, who was nailed by Harry as he
left the tower, is not Fenrir, who was petrified at the base of it

CathyD:
The DE at the top of the tower (brutal faced) was Petrified by Harry, not Stupified.  Not sure whether Scrimgeour or JKR made the mistake there.  

At this point, as I said, Scrimgeour isn't interested in getting Harry onside.  He knows he's not going to budge.  All he wanted was info on where DD went and what he and Harry did.  Greyback doesn't enter into the equasion.  Telling Harry that they had taken Greyback into custody wasn't going to influence Harry to tell him about Dumbledore. (At least Scrimgeour was smart enough to realize that...I'm not certain Fudge would have been.)

Pippin:
Wouldn't somone in the hospital wing have said, Hey, at least we
got  Fenrir?

CathyD:
I think they had more important things on their minds, questions about Bill's health, Dumbledore's death, how it all happened.  They were quite concerned with gettng the injured to the hospital wing.  Mind you, I think McGonagall or, even more so, Tonks, might have noticed if Lupin released Greyback from the curse, even if he used a non-verbal.   As well as not saying that "at least we got Fenrir" no one said, either "but then Fenrir was back up and running around again after he was petrified."  

This reminds me a great deal of the battle in the DoM.    There are 10 DEs in the Death Chamber.  Bella left.  Nine were captured by Dumbledore (we presume all nine).  What about Nott and Baby-head?  Where are they?  DD only says: "If you proceed downstairs.....you will find several *escaped* Death Eaters contained in the Death Chamber, bound by an Anti-Disapparation jinx and awaiting your decision as to what to do with them."  Lucius Malfoy wasn't an *escaped* DE yet we know he's in Azkaban. Avery and Macnair had not excaped Azkaban either (they were in the graveyard at the end of GOF)  Did Nott and Baby-Head Disapparate?  Who knows?  Nobody - yet - well, except JKR, *knows* what happened to Fenrir.  Until she says otherwise, IMO, Greyback is in MoM custody.

Pippin:
Ah, but what if Peter wasn't a willing spy at all, but only the
reluctant betrayer of the secret? Dumbledore doesn't seem to be 
very upset about Peter's escape; he says Harry will be glad of it one
day. 

I think Dumbledore knew all along that Peter wasn't the spy. It makes
even less sense now that a non-Occlumens could get away with spying 
on Dumbledore for a year.

CathyD:
Sorry, *what ifs* don't do it for me.  And you're forgetting the prophecy. "His *servant* has been chained these twelve years." (POA
238 Can Ed) Not his one-time information passer...his *servant.*  Also: "Harry saw something upon the skin there, something like a vivid red tattoo -- a skull, with a snake protruding from its mouth -- the same image that had appeared in the sky at the Quidditch World Cup: the Dark Mark.  Voldemort examined it carefully, ignoring Wormtail's uncontrollable weeping."  (GF 560 Can Ed)  Can't imagine LV would brand somebody for one piece of information. (Just like I don't think Draco has the tattoo, yet, either) Especially when, at the time Pettigrew gave the information, only a week before the attack, there was no *proof* the information would pan out until LV went to the Potter residence and got in.  Nope, one time information passer doesn't work here, IMO.  More to the point though, LV calls Pettigrew a servant "And then, not even a year ago, when I had almost abandoned hope, it happened at last ... a *servant* returned to me: Wormtail here, who had faked his own death to escape justice, was driven out of hiding by those he had once counted as friends, and decided to return to his *master*." (GOF 568)  As Sirius said: "You haven't been hiding from me for twelve years, you've been hiding from Voldemort's old supporters.  I heard things in Azkaban, Peter ... they all think you're dead, or you'd have to answer to them...I've heard them screaming all sorts of things in their sleep.  Sounds like they think the *double crosser* double-crossed them.  Voldemort went to the Potters' on your information ...and Voldemort met his downfall there.  And not all Voldemort's supporters ended up in Azkaban, did they?  .... If they ever got wind that you were still alive, Peter -- " (POA 270)  

Pettigrew doesn't, ever, IMO, deny that he had been Voldemort's spy.  Not just the bearer of the SK info.  Sirius accuses him of "passing information to him [LV] for a year before Lily and James died! You were his spy!" Peter didn't deny it, but said "What was there to be gained by refusing him?....You don't understand, he would have killed me."  Why would Peter have thought LV would kill him if he hadn't had contact with him already?  No reason to..well, no more reason to than any other OP member had.   LV knew Pettigrew was a friend of the Potters, and LV was after the Potters, so he went after Pettigrew.  He brought Pettigrew into his *employ* to get the info he needed.  LV knew he wasn't going to get Sirius on his side.  LV didn't want Lupin, a werewolf. (Don't throw Greyback at me here.  Greyback, IMO, is *not* a DE.  He is not working *for* LV.  He is working for himself.  He knows if LV gets full power he will have freedoms he doesn't now have.  Anything he does for LV he's really doing for himself. His DE robes are too tight because they are not his but someone else's.)

Dumbledore doesn't get upset about much, though, does he, so it isn't much of a defence that he wasn't upset about Pettigrew escaping. .  Besides, he knows what good can come of Harry allowing Peter to live.  He doesn't seem all that concerned, either, that a wizard, who was supposed to be dead for 12 years, was alive, and sleeping in his school for a good number of those years.  He doesn't seem too concerned about Sirius' confession that they were illegal animagi.  Doesn't seem concerned at all that Lupin knew about that situation and never bothered to tell him that Sirius was an animagi.  Doesn't seem concerned, either, that he put Harry into a position to aid an escaped priosoner.   He doesn't even question Harry about what he did to Draco Malfoy with the Sectumsempra spell  On and on.

What makes you say that Peter is a non-Occlumens?  Where were we told that?  Dumbledore was still Headmaster, as well as the ring-leader of the OotP.  He wasn't in Peter's presence every moment.  May hardly have spent time with him at all.  All the order members in OotP had jobs to do and went about doing them.  I'm sure it was the same in the first war.  Remember, we only saw Emmeline Vance, Elphias Doge, Dedalus Diggle, Sturgis Podmore, Kingsley Shacklebolt and Hestia Jones on the one occasion where they rescued Harry from the Dursley's.  The rest of the time, they were going about their business for the Order.  They weren't popping in to HQ every day, or every few days.  Only Kingsley Shacklebolt and Moody  made it to the dinner on the last night before the kids went back to Hogwarts.  Tonks was there more than the rest but for, now what we know were obvious reasons: Lupin lived there.

Dumbledore already suspected Sirius, wrongly.  Didn't suspect Peter Pettigrew, wrongly.  Half the Wizarding World now thinks he was wrong to trust Snape.  He can't possibly be wrong about everyone he is in contact with?  Capable of mistakes in judgement yes, but he's not a fool.  Lupin doesn't *appear* to be an Occlumens either, how did he keep his spying secrets from Dumbledore?  He didn't have to, he wasn't in LV's employ.  


CathyD
Sorry, Pippin, I wasn't ignoring you.  I really wanted to reply to this sooner but owing to circumstances beyond my control - couldn't focus my eyes for nearly two days - I had to wait.  It was easy enough to make your e-mail big enough to read, but my wand was backfiring and I couldn't get my books to enlarge! ;)

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