[HPforGrownups] Re: HBP The memory in the cave... is Snape's (or is it Tom Sr.'s?)

[Kathryn Jones]

No: HPFGUIDX 138052

justcarol67 wrote:


> At any rate, regarding the potion/poison in the cave:
snip
> The chief questions are whose memory it is (assuming that it's a real
> memory) and what, if anything, Snape had to do with it.


> As for Snape's having something to do with creating the potion/poison,
> as some posters (I can't remember who) have proposed, how could he
> have done so? He was eleven years old when Voldemort returned and
> started recruiting followers, and by that time, Voldemort had long
> since created most if not all of his Horcruxes. The locket and cup
> were the third and fourth that he acquired, back when he was not long
> out of Hogwarts and Severus Snape had not even been born. Surely
> Voldemort had created and hidden the locket Horcrux between that time
> and his interview with Dumbledore for the DADA position, which
> occurred when Severus was about three years old (and initiated the
> DADA curse). I see no reason why he would have hidden the locket
> Horcrux a second time or brewed a new thought/memory potion some
> eighteen years later using Snape's memories. And I doubt very much
> that Snape, protective as he is of his memories, would have brewed
> such a potion himself, however unlikely it might be that anyone would
> experience the memory and survive to reveal it.
   Carol

Kathy writes:

     I agree completely that Snape had nothing to do with the cave, or 
the manufacture of the potion. I also don't believe that Snape's 
memories are in the pensieve or the potion. That does not make logical 
sense. What does make sense to me are the following points:

1.  We have seen Harry sneaking into peoples' pensieves twice in the 
books. Obviously, they are not the safest place to put things that you 
don't ever want shared.

2.  If you need to get rid of memories, you can do several things, such 
as store them in bottles, store them in pensieves, have them obliviated, 
or give them to someone else for their perusal or safe-keeping.

3.  It is logical to me that the memories we hear in the cave are from 
Dumbledore's mind, not the potion. The potion is causing a replay of 
what might be the worst memories.

4.  Dumbledore has an extremely good reason for his absolute trust in 
Snape. He could have used veritaserum to question Snape, or legilimency. 
JKR says that either one can be fooled or circumvented by an occlumens. 
What apparently can't be fooled without being obvious are memories in a 
pensieve.

5.  Which all leads me to believe that Dumbledore is carrying Snape's 
memories for safe-keeping. I believe that some of those memories are 
from Godric's Hollow. What better proof could there be that Snape was 
genuinely remorseful about spilling the prophesy and causing the deaths 
of James and Lily. Dumbledore could not tell Harry that because he can 
not risk Voldemort finding it in Harry's head.
KJ


> Carol, hoping that someone will slog through the DADA curse post (link
> above) and respond to it. The key parts relate to Quirrell, Lupin, and
> Snape, exactly the parts that didn't get answered.
   Carol

Kathy writes:
    I did actually read your post and found very little to argue with. A 
slightly different viewpoint perhaps. What I see is that Snape had to be 
aware of the hex on the job. He applied for it every year on Voldemort's 
original orders and continued it at Dumbledore's request. When Snape was 
given the job, he had to have known that it was his last year teaching 
DADA. He might have had a vague hope that he could go back to teaching 
potions when things started to go bad. I think that the jerk in his hand 
during the UV was the vision of the handwriting on the wall. He may have 
thought that there would be a way around it, and I am sure that he told 
Dumbledore, but it must have looked to him that either he or Dumbledore 
were going to end up dead.
    Other than that, I thought it was a marvelous post. Allll of it. :-)
KJ