What would Snape have to do....

[Cathy Drolet]

No: HPFGUIDX 138517

doddiemoemoe
>>What would Snape have to do to redeem himself? Now in my book it's nothing.

CathyD:
Same with me, but that's because, in *my* book, he's already been redeemed when he joined the Order of the Phoenix fifteen or so years ago.

>>He's responsible for the deaths of Lilly and James Potter.

Yes, he is, but he also worked with Dumbledore to try to prevent it once he found out what LV was intending to do with the information he had.

>>He's even responsible for Harry being the chosen one.

Yes, he is, although it was certainly not in any way planned by Snape.  He had no way of knowing what LV would do with the prophecy information, and as soon as he found out, he went to Dumbledore for help.

>>He's cruel to Neville, Hermione and Harry.

Lots of teachers are cruel to students, it's not a jailable offence.  I could give you quite a list of teachers I know personally who were cruel to kids in classes.  Snape taught the only way he knew how: by being tough. (I had a teacher just like him in 7th grade and some kids, who never did well before, blossomed under his method.) In Snape's shoes I'd have told Hermione more than once to sit down, shut up and not raise her had again for the rest of the class.  Snape knows what he did (passing info to LV) is what made Harry and Neville what they are.  He knows they need to be stronger and better wizards than they currently are to fight the coming battle (especially the Chosen One).  You and I would maybe have taken Neville aside and tutored him, and helped him along.  Snape doesn't know how to teach in that way.  What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.  Snape knows nothing he does in this class is going to kill Harry or Neville, but it will make them stronger.  There are many lessons to be learned in life, nasty teachers are one of them.  And we must remember that Harry is not always innocent, either.  He doesn't pay attention in class, doesn't always complete his homework to the best of his ability, doesn't study, doesn't try.

>>He's responsible for the fate of Neville's parents.

Yes, he is, in the same way he is responsible for Harry being the chosen one.  It is not something he intended, but by giving LV the prophecy information, something LV made happen.  Snape already attempted to counter that by taking the information to Dumbledore.

>>He made an unbreakable vow to ensure DD was killed. (or that Harry 
would be killed in some theories)

He made an Unbreakable Vow.  As someone, I wish I could remember who, recently pointed out, Snape made the Unbreakable Vow based on what he and Narcissa had just said, that it would be possible for him to help Draco and that he would protect him.  I think Narcissa threw him a curve with that last "if it seems Draco will fail, will you carry out the deed" but at that point he was trapped by his own decision to go ahead with an Unbreakable Vow when it truly was not necessary.  Neither Narcissa nor Bellatrix could go back to LV and say that Snape had not agreed to the Vow.  They weren't supposed to be discussing the Plan with anyone.  Pettigew wouldn't go...he was too busy staying away from LV.  LV would never know that he didn't take a vow so he wouldn't even have to come up with an excuse.

>>He let slip that Lupin was a werewolf.

Well, as Lupin himself said, people were going to find out anyway.  Hermione had already figured it out, as would probably several of the others IF they had bothered to do the homework instead of whining about it.  

>>He let slip that Sirius was an animagus. (causing him to be an 
absolute prisoner in OOP--and please note that as rash, angry and 
irritable as Sirius became he still never revealed that Snape was 
a "double spy" or even that he was a DE.)

Did he?  I thought it was Pettigrew, since Pettigrew left Hogwarts at the end of PoA and went straight to find VapourMort in Albania.  According to GoF, Sirius said: "But as far as I know, Snape was never even accused of being a Death Eater..."  He couldn't reveal what he didn't know.  As for *double spy* I think, when Snape came over to the OotP, Dumbledore kept that quite a secret.  Dumbledore knew, himself, that there was a spy in the Order, and he could not risk Snape's life.  If too many people in the Order knew, the spy could out Snape to LV.

>>He states he passed the information to have Vance killed.  

A lie.  He knew Bellatrix had no way to confirm this information as she is no longer one of LV's insiders.

>>He joined the DE's of his own accord, he didn't back out right away 
either(he "left" for completely different reasons than Regulus Black 
for example).

How do you know that?  Sirius said, Regulus got in so far, panicked about what he was being asked to do, and tried to back out.  Regulus' problem is he didn't have anyone to go to for help.  Snape did.  I see Snape as quite the same as Regulus.  He joined the DE's for whatever reason (we don't yet know), passed the Prohecy information, then panicked when he realized what LV was about to do...kill a baby...and went to the one person he knew could help - Dumbledore - help both him out of the DE situation, and help protect the family of the baby as well. 

>>With this much blood, heartache and sorrow....how can he possibly 
redeem himself?!?!?

As I said before, he's already been redeemed by turning from the DE's to the Order.  The whole problem is, Dumbledore didn't share the personal information of why Snape switched sides, and so the redemption has so far only been seen by Dumbledore and Snape.  I'm quite certain we, as well as the OotP members, will see it in the next book.

>>DD gave him a chance, and in my opinion, Snape failed miserably..(as 
a teacher, mentor and colleague)

Oh, I've thought he did remarkably well.  He got 10 of 40 students in Harry's year to achieve an Outstanding Owl.  Well, 10 that continued on to NEWT potions.  There may have been more who didn't need NEWT level potions.  Who is Snape supposed to be menotoring?  Slytherin kids by my estimation.  I think he does all right there.  Snape thwarted all attempts of Quirrell to gain the Philosopher's Stone, not to mention saving Harry's life into the mix.  Prepared, perfectly, the Wolfsbane potion for Lupin...although he detested the sight of him, didn't trust him and told Dumbledore so.  He was right by Dumbledore's side when Dumbledore realized Moody wasn't who he appeared to be...showed up in Moody's Foe-Glass as I recall. Shoved his Dark Mark tattooed arm under Cornelius Fudge's stupid nose to prove that Dumbledore was right about LV having returned to full strength.  Provided Umbridge with fake Veritaserum when she wanted to interrogate Harry.  Provided the counter-curse/potion that saved Dumbledore's life after his encounter with the Ring/Horcrux.  Provided information on the DE/LV activities to the Order of the Phoenix including that LV was after the Prophecy and LV's reaction to the destruction of the Diary which I'm sure was very informative to Dumbledore.  Need I say more?

>>If Snape can dupe Voldemort...why not DD?!?!?

Very true.  But Dumbledore has a reason to trust Snape.  A very good reason and more than just the waffle he told Harry.  And it is obvious, to me at least, that Voldemort does not trust anyone, not even Snape.  

>>Did/has Snape ever truly duped either one?(I maybe have some 
sympathy for him if he hasn't---but sympathy doesn't mean I believe 
he's redeemed.) 

I think he has duped LV quite well.  But that's JMO.

>>Evil/Not Evil/Entirely Selfish....I still don't see redemtion in him.

>>Realization of one's mistake doesn't mean redemption...attempting to 
right a wrong may lead to redemption...but in my opinion Snape 
simply has too many wrongs to right in one book.

>> And, as I've said, he righted a lot of those wrongs, back before James and Lily were murdered, when he joined the Order of the Phoenix and passed to Dumbledore the information of what LV was about to do so Dumbledore could put a plan into place to protect James, Lily, and Harry.  It is not Snape's fault that the wrong Secret-Keeper was chosen.  

>>He'd have to do more than help or even save Harry in my mind's eye.

I find that quite sad, really.  If Dumbledore, himself, through a bottled memory, reveals the real reason Snape turned from DE to OotP?  If Snape killed Nagini, thus destroying a Horcrux?  If Snape finds the hiding places of the other Horcruxes and/or destroys any of them?  If Snape provides potions/counter-charms-jinxes that stop/prevent Harry's (or Ron's or Hermione's) death after dealing with future Horcruxes?  If Snape is still capable of communicatiing via a patronus...a patronus in the shape of a bumblebee (thank you Carol...I love that idea)?  If Snape stepped between a DE and the Trio saving their lives as they Apparate away while losing his own by showing his true allegiance?

>>He's like an over-grown bat....IOW  a rodent/rat with wings..

Ah, but JKR has already ruled out that possibility. ;)


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