Harry's character development

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 139232

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "quick_silver71"
<quick_silver71 at y...> wrote:
> "Steve" <bboyminn at y...> wrote:
> > ... If it had been me, I would be researching Dark Arts and 
> > Anti-Dark Arts with every free minute of time. ...He has a set of 
> > Defense Against Dark Art Encyclopedias ... given to him ... by 
> > Sirius and Remus. ..., he would have done much better to study 
> > and practice from his Defense Against Dark Arts book set. 
 

> quick_silver71:
> 
> Would they teach him what he needs to know or what he thinks that he 
> needs to know. ... there is more to fighting Voldemort then throwing
> out spells.
> 

bboyminn:

Yet when the final showdown comes, 'throwing out spells' is exactly
what Harry is going to have to do. It's entirely possible that
Voldemort won't be alone when Harry comes to him, and that means
fighting his way through a horde of DE's before he can even get to
Voldemort. 

Harry's knowledge of spells and his ability to cast them is going to
be critical in the end. Certainly not THE critical factor, but
critical none the less, you can't defeat the enemy unless you can get
to him.


> quick_silver71:
>
> Harry is already a good dueler. 

bboyminn:

I'm not sure where you get this. Harry's dueling skill has never been
more than adequate. At best, he as stumbled through each duel with a
bit of luck and little more. 

In his duels with Draco, Harry has just scraped by with luck. Draco
and Harry are about an equal match, although in the duel in the
bathroom in HBP, Draco seems to have the upper hand until Harry cast
the 'Sectumsempra'. Of course, Harry was on target so regardless of
what curse he cast he would have had the advantage, but let's not
forget that up until that point Draco was standing and Harry was on
the floor stuggling.

In his duel with Voldemort at the end of GoF, again Harry is
hopelessly outclassed. It was only by a stroke of luck that Harry and
Voldemort cast curses at the same time and invoked the 'Brother Wand'
effect. 

And I will remind everyone again, that Harry and Voldemort will have
no trouble exchanging curses with each other. The 'Brother Wand'
effect only comes into play under a very precise set of circumstances;
both casters have to cast at the same instant, and the curses have to
meet head-on and collide with each others. Any other circumstances are
just plain dueling, the 'Brother Wand' effect doesn't come into play.
So, my point is that Harry didn't prevail by his superior dueling
skills, he prevail by shear dumb luck.

In the duel or fight at the Ministy, it's clear that Harry is out
manned, out classed, and out gunned, and would have surely lost except
for shear luck and the arrival of the Order.

> quick_silver71:
>
> He loses to Snape at the end of HBP because Snape is deploying
> everything he has against Harry...his non-verbal skills and his 
> Legilimency. ... 

bboyminn:

I don't see Snape 'deploying everything'. Using everything - yes, but
'deploying everything' in the context you imply - no.  What I see
Snape doing is defeating Harry at every turn and he does so easily.
Snape has higher priorities, saving Draco and getting the heck out of
there; Harry is more like an annoying tedious fly that is bothering
Snape. Snape's superiority over Harry seems easy and effortless to me. 

> quick_silver71:
>
> It will be when Harry learns either more non-verbal magic or how to 
> block his mind that he will be a match for Snape 
> ...

bboyminn:

And that is pretty much what I said. Harry NEEDS to practice his
non-verbal skill but he isn't. Harry needs to practice his Occlumency
but he's not. He needs to refine his fighting skill, but he's not. He
need to learn more complex and powerful curses, both offensive and
defensive, but he's not. The poor boy can't relie on pure dumb luck
forever. To many battles were lost, though some were won, because a
Commander shrugged his shoulders and said, who knows maybe we'll get
lucky.

> > bboyminn orginally said:
> >
> > Look at how easily Dumbledore manuvered though the maze of
> > enchantments in the cave, would it have killed him to explain to 
> > Harry...

> quick_silver71:
> 
> Yet J.K. has said that Dumbledore was mainly self-taught. Perhaps he 
> takes the view that Harry must learn these things on his own. 
> Despite finding Snape's copy of Advanced Potion-Making Harry showed 
> no willingness to expand upon it. Rather then find his own way Harry 
> stole another's...perhaps Dumbledore is discouraging that?
>  
> Quick Silver

bboyminn:

Not familiar with that quote but it seems more than reasonable. BUT...
Dumbledore was ALWAYS an outstanding wizard and he has had 150 years
of experience. Harry has been a just above average student and gets
one more year and nothing more. He can't possibly hope to learn enough
to defeat Voldemort, or at least, enough to fight his way to Voldemort
without MUCH MORE practice. 

I will agree however that it's not all about dueling and curses. But
none the less, Harry can't go after Voldemort completely unprepared.
He has to have fast reflexes, he has to have a reasonable complement
of spells that not only does he know, but that he is proficient at, he
has to be able to defend and protect himself as well as attack his
enemies, and while damn lucky, his is currently ill-prepared to do that. 

At least that's how I see it.

Steve/bboyminn