Snape: Crime and Punishment

[lupinlore]

No: HPFGUIDX 143792

Steve wrote:

<SNIP>
> Many people, for a variety of reasons, are insisting
that Snape suffer in some way for the way he treated Harry and
Neville. Many futher feel that the book will not make sense if this 
doesn't come to pass.

LUPINLORE:

Oh, absolutely. Snape must be punished for the books to reach a 
balance point. Now, there are a lot of ways to get there. As you and 
others have pointed out, there is a great deal to be done in the last 
book, and I expect most of it will be handled in a telegraphic, by 
the numbers fashion that we have already scene in HBP. Snape, 
Wormtail, Percy, others will almost certainly be dealt with an a 
paragraph or a condensed scene. In fact, I don't see that JKR has 
time to spend very much time on anything in the last book, any way 
you cut it.

STEVE:

> 
> I'm here to say, that it is very likely that it will
NOT come to pass. Why? Because, in real life, this rarely happens. 

LUPINLORE:

Sure. And terrorists very often escape punishment as well. But I 
think it would be a terrible move on JKR's part to let Voldemort off 
the hook. No, Snape and Voldemort are not the same.
But both must be punished for their sins.

STEVE:
> 
The universal appeal of the books is that they are morally ambiguous. 
The good guy doesn't always win, the bad guys aren't clearly defined, 
and it isn't always fair; just like real life.

LUPINLORE:

Is that their "universal" appeal? I'm not so sure they will be 
morally ambiguous, of if they are that such is their
appeal at all (which isn't very universal, the vast majority of
people in the world wouldn't give you a set of fingernail clippings
for the Potterverse). Many people think that in the end the
morality willbe very clear and quite poetic, or karmic to use one
of Alla's terms.

You know this reminds me a lot of some of the discussions we saw 
before HBP came out (all of these are paraphrases):
"We have heard everything we are going to hear about Dumbledore and
his decision to leave Harry at the Dursleys. Life isn't fair and Harry
must learn to accept that with no further explanation." "The
Dursleys will never be called to task for how they treated Harry."
"The Umbridge affair is over. She and her quill and Harry's scar
will never be mentioned again. Harry must accept that life isn't
fair and that Umbridge will never be punished for her acts."

Will Snape be the exception? Maybe, but it will be an 
extraordinarily bad move on JKR's part. And yes, even
morally suspect in many people's eyes. She may not care, but
hey, that's the way it is.

STEVE:

To some extent this is reflected in Snape pushing Harry hand Ron's 
heads down and wacking them with a composition notebook in the latest 
film. But the reality is, that Snbape's action in the film were 
extremely mild compared to real British schools of not that long ago.

LUPINLORE:

Yes, and slavery was allowed in the U.S. until 1865
and Jim Crow laws until the 1960s. Does this excuse the WW for
keeping slaves (and I do think we need to see some movement on that
issue as well)? The mores of a backward and corrupt society
provide no defense and do not excuse Snape from punishment, such
is a special case of "Ignorance of the law is no excuse."


STEVE:
<SNIP>
> 
> I think accusations of /abuse/ on his part are not
so much a matter of reality, as they are a matter of overblown,
overhyped, ultra-liberal thinking. (Sorry, I know that stings a bit, 
and for the record, I do consider myself a liberal; just not an 
overhyped ultra-liberal.)

LUPINLORE:
Well, I will have to most severely disagree. Child abuse fits quite 
well, IMO, even if it is not as bad as many other
situations. I do like being grouped with ultra-liberals, however. I
generally get put on the opposite end of the spectrum.


STEVE:

> In short, in real life, the bad guys don't always
get punished. 
> 

LUPINLORE:

Nope. And that's why we read novels. If I wanted to be
caught in the dreary realities of the unjust world I'd sit in
front of C-Span, and no doubt eventually perish from Russian Roulette.

STEVE:

> Let's see if I can add one more short note about
Snape. I have already said the even under the most ideal 
circumstances,the wizard world will never forgive or forget that 
Snape killed Dumbledore. 

LUPINLORE:

Which has no pertinence whatsoever to the abuse situation. Snape must 
be punished for the way he has abused Harry and Neville, quite 
regardless of his status with regard to Dumbledore or what happened 
in the tower.

STEVE:
> 
> I do believe that Snape is the only source of help
for Harry in finding the Horcrux. That knowledge reside inside
Voldemort's inner circle, and it is information that is held by an
EXTREMELY FEW people.Now that Snape is trusted above all others, I 
think he will help
> Harry.  

LUPINLORE:

Which would be lazy and cheesey writing, in addition
to making a hero out of a child abuser. Not a good move, that
would be, as Yoda might say.

STEVE:

I have futher said that Snape understood he was commitingan 
unforgivable act for which he would surely suffer, either in prison 
or by death, a great punishment. That is the foundation of Snape 
objection to Harry calling him a coward. Snape has
done both an immensely brave and simultaniously cowardly thing in
killing Dumbledore. He has made a sacrific in the extreme by
his action, a sacrifice that may indeed cost him his life. 

LUPINLORE:

And our Lord and Savior Severus Snape ascends to his calvary, 
offering himself as a sacrifice for the Wizarding World. Which 
would turn the saga into "The Redemption of Severus Snape," preserve 
DD as wise, and turn Harry into a buffoon who needs to learn that 
being abused is only the path to greater understanding
of your true friends. Problematic, to put it mildly.


STEVE:

<SNIP>
> 
 But I think in the end, Snape will in some way
> redeem himself, but that act of redemption, while it
will mitigate his prior actions, will never erase them.

LUPINLORE:

Well, if he includes somewhere in there a sincere apology for the 
way he's treated Harry and Neville, he will be redeemed. Otherwise, 
well, I guess there's always room in the hot place(and probably work 
for a good potion maker, too).


Lupinlore