[HPforGrownups] Trevor incident again WAS: Re: Please explain.

[Irene Mikhlin]

No: HPFGUIDX 144241

It's midnight here. :-)

dumbledore11214 wrote:

>>eggplant107 wrote:
>>
>>Snape must have known his
>>words would terrorize
>>>an eleven year old boy,

> Irene: 
> 
>>Trevor's incident didn't happen during year 1, did
it?
> 
> 
> Alla:
> 
> Are you saying that third year student cannot be
scared that his pet 
> will be poisoned? 

No, I'm just correcting the misconception above, that
Neville was 11 at the time.

>
> Irene:
> 
> 
>>I was not going for "no harm no foul" argument about
>>Trevor. I do think intentions are important (still
>>waiting to learn about Sirius intentions :-)). But I
>>don't think Snape's intentions were to kill Trevor.
Or
>>to horrify Neville for his sadistic pleasure.
>>I've just noticed that many "motivational" verbs
seem
>>to suggest pain:
>>to spur, goad, push, prod, poke, thrust. I wonder
why.
>>:-)
> 
> Alla:
> 
> So, if you were not going for "no harm no foul"
argument about 
> Trevor, could you clarify what type of argument you
were going for?

I think this incident should not be described in the
terms "Snape was going to poison Trevor, but Hermione
saved the day".
Snape told Neville that they will feed his potion at
the end of the lesson. It means that it's all in
Neville's hands. It means that he should feel in
control. It's not like Snape prepared a poison and
intends to give it to Trevor depending on Neville's
behaviour.

The students use their own pets as Transfiguration
props. What if the transfiguration goes wrong?
Shouldn't they feel constantly scared that McGonagall
won't fix the situation?

> 
> You said upthread that how could we blame Snape for
what Neville was 
> thinking, right? Since to me the answer is very
clear - because Snape 
> made Neville to believe it, I am not sure how can we
NOT to blame 
> Snape for what Neville was thinking?

In OoTP Slytherins ridicule Gryffindor quidditch team.
It does not work on Harry, but it works on Ron (I'm
talking about run-up to the first game). Why? Because
internally Harry knows he is a competent quidditch
player, and Ron thinks the opposite of himself. Their
different reaction is due to their internal reasons,
not something that happens or does not happen
externally.
In HBP Harry disagrees with Snape's opinion on
Dementors. But he calmly writes an essay with the
answers he thinks are correct. If it was Potions essay
a year earlier, Harry would huff, and puff, and rant
about the evil git and probably copy Hermione's work.
Why he is so calm about submitting Dementors essay?
Because internally he knows he is competent in DADA,
and he knows his essay is good.
What I'm getting to - in my opinion a person is
responsible for his own thoughts. The only way Neville
could have made his potions experience more pleasant
was to become competent.
JKR has chosen not to show it. But I'll be happy for
Neville when he kills Bellatrix. That's competence
enough, and Potions will be water under the bridge
then.

> 
> I mean, it is not like Neville believed that Trevor
will die for no 
> reason. The belief is very rational, no? 

No, just as Harry feeling "imprisoned" during the
first occlumency lesson was not rational. At this
point in time Snape hasn't harmed any of the students
or their pets, so the belief is irrational.

> 
> Aren't you saying that since Trevor was not harmed
that is why we 
> should not blame Snape?

No, I'm saying that Snape wasn't going to harm Trevor
in the first place. No canonical proof for that,
unfortunately.
But in any case, Trevor's fate was fully in Neville's
hands. That aspect of the situation seems often lost
in our discussions.

Irene


		
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