Another Curse-Breaker - Random Thoughts

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 145066

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Ceridwen" <ceridwennight at h...>
wrote:
>  ...edited...
>
> Ceridwen:
> 
> 
> Ceridwen:
> At first, I read this to mean that if a DADA teacher was
> competent, he or she would have been able to break the curse
> on the position. Reading it again, I see that you're saying
> that they've pretty much reached the dregs, ...
> 
> You do wonder why Dumbledore excludes Snape from the horcrux
> hunt. I can see why he would involve Harry, since that's Harry's
> mission, and Harry was more successful at destroying the one he
> did destroy, which may or may not mean that he has a talent in
> that direction.
> 

bboyminn:

We know that Snape helped Dumbledore after he returned from retrieving
and destorying the Gaunt/Slytherin Ring. I have to believe that Snape
has some knowledge of what Dumbledore is doing. But how much? That is
the big question.

Dumbledore seems to consistently only tell people as much as HE needs
them to know. I think that is mostly a matter of security, and the
Order, teachers, and others accept that blindly because they have
absolute trust in Dumbledore. They are sure that Dumbledore has a plan
and a purpose even if he doesn't tell them. However, it they did not
have that level of trust in Dumbledore, I don't think they would be so
willing to act on such scant information. 

So, I think, just do to their secondary interactions related to the
Horcruxes, that Snape does have some general knowledge. I think he
goes back to Voldemort's camp knowing what Voldemort's strength and
his weaknesses are; relative to the Horcruxes. But I don't think he
necessarily knows Dumbledore's plan; yes, his general plan, but not
his specific plan. 

However, that doesn't really matter anymore. Dumbledore is gone, and
now they (who ever 'they' may be) will have to create a plan of their
own using whatever information they have available to them.

So, I don't think the question is so much 'Does Snape know?', but 'How
much does Snape know?'.



> Ceridwen:
>
> Maybe not all Dark Curses are equal.  If they were, wouldn't
> someone have been able to break the curse on the DADA position 
> before now? It would be a simple matter for the school to bring
> in a professonal curse breaker, wouldn't it?  Unless there was 
> something special about LV's curse. ...


bboyminn:

I think one of the problems with the Curse on the DADA job is that it
is so abstract. I can see the curse/jinx being put on it, but how do
you remove it? What is a 'job' afteral? Can you hold it up in front of
you? Can you contain it in a box? Can you lay in on a table and study
it? It's easy to say break the curse on the 'job', but how do you find
it, where do you direct your effort? I think this is the reason the
curse/jinx has lasted so long, because it is next to impossible to
find the 'object' that you are trying to uncurse.

One suggestion I would make, and they may have thought of it ...or
not. That is to get rid of the DADA position. So rather than a DADA
professor, they would bring in a person to teach 'Applied Defensive
Magical Theory' (ADMT), or Practical Defensive Magic (PDM), or
eliminating all reference to 'defense', 'Applied Anti-Dark Arts Magic
(AADAM - nice acronym), or whatever. Essentially, you are teaching the
same subject, but not under the banner of 'Defense Against Dark Arts'.
If it is truly the 'job' that is curse, then simply create a new and
different job. 

Maybe that's a little to obvious to work, but it does bring up one of
my many theories. Perhaps in the next book the position of DADA
Professor will go unfilled. The individual teachers will take it in
turn to teach the classes the basics necessary to complete their DADA
OWL exams, and here's the cool part, they will invite Harry back to
the school to manage the DA Club, to give both Harry and the Students
the practical defensive experience they need in the real world. 

It wouldn't be a full time job, and actually not a job at all. He
would simply come to the school periodically and with the assistance
of the original DA Club members, train any interested student. So, he
would still have time to pursue all the other things demanding his
time, and he would have access to Hogwarts and their teachers as
necessary resources.
 

> Ceridwen:
>
>...edited
> 
> I'm just trying to get around the idea of Bill Weasley being a
> curse  breaker, so there are such people, and the curses on
> things like the opal necklace, the horcruxes, and the DADA
> position that can't seem to be un-cursed. The ancient Egyptians
> were no sluggards when it came to curses, according to all the
> hype in and out of HP.  Why isn't there someone who can lift 
> these curses?  Makes me wonder.
> 

bboyminn:

There is one advantage to Bill's style of curse breaking, and that is
time. Bill can go to Egypt and take many months to study a tomb and
the curses on it. He would have examples of people who have been
previously curse lying dead in the tomb. He would have time to look
for the magical source of a specific curse, and he would probably have
a team of other curse breakers working with him. That quite different
from trying to break the curse on something as abstract as a 'job'.

> Ceridwen:
>
> But, back to your point, Snape (or Lupin, or Bill) would be
> logical choices to help with the horcruxes due to their more 
> advanced knowledge. I think Dumbledore didn't include them 
> because of the secrecy which needs to be maintained so LV 
> doesn't know what's going on. The fewer, the better in this case!
> 
> I do think Snape knew about the ring being a horcrux, because as
> you said, he would need to know the magic involved in the injury 
> (and may probably have recognized it anyway, as a DADA expert), 
> in order to begin the healing or at least stop the spread of the 
> curse.
> 
> ...
> 
> Ceridwen.  "Don't call me Alice". ;)
>

bboyminn:

I seriously hope Harry starts drawing on the resources that are
available to him. I just don't see how he accomplish is task, unless
he taps those resources. Further, I agree with you idea about
Dumbledore and secrecy. Dumbledore is not known to give out any
information that he doesn't feel a person specifically needs to do
their job. Given that there are spies and people under Voldemort's
control everywhere, Dumbledore would be foolish to take that risk. On
the other hand, it was foolish of Dumbleodore not to give various
people bits of information that could be combined into some semblance
of his original grand plan. To keep that all to himself, really leaves
the Order at a disadvantage right now.

As far as Snape, as I said before, I think he had some general
knowledge about the Horcruxes and used that general knowledge to reach
logical conclusions about what Dumbledore was doing and how the
Horcruxes fit into the plan. Since Dumbledore hasn't specifically
given Snape the full information, Snape can deny that he knows, and
within a certain context, be making a truthful statement. I think this
context driven truth comes in very handy for a spy like Snape.

Just a few random thoughts.

Steve/bboyminn