Heroes or not

[Jen Reese]

No: HPFGUIDX 145189

Alla (comment apparated from #145160):
> Yes, I understand that. And here I think lies my answer to Jen
> Reese.( if she will read this post of course :-)) She asked in one
> of her posts why ESE! or OFH!version of Snape is more interesting.
> To me it is because it allows Snape to change during the story, 
> not in the distant past - Snape was DE , saw the error of his 
> ways, came to Dumbledore, boom, his story is done. No, to me Snape
> who commits evil deeds or good deeds in front of us and struggles
> with consequences is more interesting that static Snape.

Jen: Alla, I read all your posts :). Truth be told, since September 
I've probably read every post on the list. Hopefully that will make 
someone feel better who worries about spending too much time here.

Thanks for answering that question because I do see your side of 
things and how that makes a very interesting story. I think my view 
of Snape has a bit of your struggle in it, though not to the same 
extent. See to me, a Snape who had a personal transformation which 
led him away from Voldemort and a Snape who changed in front of us 
in HBP are not mutually exclusive. I think Snape did indeed leave 
Voldemort once and for all way back when, and he has never 
considered returning to life as a DE. But I don't think loyalty to 
Dumbledore has been a natural fit for him, either. There has likely 
been increasing pressure from Dumbledore since Harry arrived at 
Hogwarts, first as another set of eyes to watch out for Harry and 
then when Voldemort regained his body, the intensity of practicing 
nonstop Occlumency and playing a dangerous double-agent game. 

I don't think returning to Voldemort has ever been in question 
myself, but I think meeting the demands Dumbledore placed on him was 
getting increasingly difficult. Being Dumbledore's ally is a 
thankless job, really. He asks the very things of people which are 
THE most difficult to give: If you like comfort and security, he 
asks you to risk your neck; if you prefer fighting the good fight 
and feeling useful, you get locked up in your miserable childhood 
home. Werewolf trying to find paying work and live among wizards? 
Back to the exiled werewolf camp you go. Young man with a heart of 
gold who has a 'saving people' thing? Shove a nasty potion down the 
protesting throat of an old man and trusted mentor. My guess is 
Snape's least wanted task in life was to protect James Potter's son, 
so guess what? That was his ring in hell. And it was getting to him. 

It would be interesting if Snape were wavering in his loyalty 
throughout HBP. I don't think Snape himself knew his true feelings 
until that moment on the tower. If he really was someone with a 
history of slithering out of action and that wasn't just what he did 
to survive being a DE, then his choice on the tower was crucial. I 
think that's why Dumbledore pleaded with him to make the right 
choice, i.e., to safeguard Harry after Dumbledore's death, rather 
than commanding Snape to do so. Dumbledore had done everything he 
could do for Snape at that point, the choice was his.

Betsy:
> Harry has had crucial help, without which he would have failed, in 
> every single book in the series.  Of course, in every single book 
> there is a moment when Harry stands alone, to succeed or fail on
> his own. A crucial assist from Snape in book 7 would be along the
> same lines, I think.  Snape may well be the key to getting Harry 
> onto the field of battle, but the battle will be Harry's alone.

Jen: What could Snape offer Harry that no one else could? I think it 
would have to be intelligence from inside Voldemort's camp. He's it. 
And somehow I think Dobby will be involved. ;) Since he's a free 
elf, he won't pass on to anyone else and if he thought following an 
order by Dumbledore even after death would save Harry, Dobby would 
do it in a heartbeat. He would keep Dumbledore's secrets even though 
he wasn't enslaved to him. I just keep thinking of that line in HBP, 
when McGonagall was pressing Harry to tell him what Dumbledore was 
doing the night he died and Harry said: "Professor Dumbledore never 
told me to stop following his orders if he died." I could see Dobby 
feeling the same way. 

Betsy: 
> Plus, if Harry has to gain an understanding of Snape to *gain* 
> that key, it makes the victory even *more* Harry's to my mind. 
> I think Snape is very much a "there but for the grace of God" 
> figure for Harry.  If Harry becomes consumed by his hatred he
> could become the very thing he hates.  But if he takes that extra,
> heroic step, of getting beyond his hatred, well, than he becomes a
> man in a way that Snape has never achieved.  And again, that gives
> the lion's share of the victory to Harry.

Jen: I second that. I think the moment of identification from Harry 
will come in a situation where he sees himself in Snape. There was a 
glimmer of it after the Pensieve scene, then again when Harry met 
the HBP. Perhaps it will be what Sydney and Orna were discussing, 
the guilt Harry will probably feel about following Dumbledore's 
orders in the cave, and the moment of discovery that Snape felt the 
same revulsion on the tower and guilt afterward.

Jen, thinking Valky's latest post about the ring curse as the cause-
of-death for Dumbledore would be the best 'out' for getting around 
the UV.