Heroes and Not - What should Snape Have Done?

[ornadv]

No: HPFGUIDX 145439

bboyminn:
> I don't think the 'force' of the UV turns you into a mindless robot
> who is forced to act. I do believe you can summor a force of
> resistance against the compulsion to fulfill the Vow. Yet, as you
> summon the will to resist, that starts a cascade that makes the
> compulsion to act that much stronger...

>Ceridwen:
>As Orna pointed out, even Imperio can be fought. But look at what
>happened to Barty Crouch sr. when he tried, it seemed his mind was
>going. But something like the UV would give you the immediate
>compulsion to just do it. <snip>
>Once you have agreed to the UV and have taken the vow, it is
>internalized. Unlike Expeliarmus (yes, I know this isn't Dark
>Magic), the UV works from the inside, so there's nothing to block.

Orna:
Agree. Crouch illustrates that fighting the curse is damaging. I 
suppose it was more damaging to him, since he might have loyalty 
conflict – turning his son in, or resisting the curse. I think it 
might have to do with the UV, since breaking it, or postponing it 
the way Steve or I suggested, would have consequences on the way you 
function with your thoughts and mind. 

>Ceridwen:
>I think, in the case of the UV, it would work like a thermostat set
>to a particular temperature. When the air gets too hot or too cold,
>the A/C or heat kick in. With the UV, when certain criteria germain
>to the vow are met, the UV kicks in. <snip>

Orna:
Like this metaphor. It also leaves room for the possibility, that if 
you are good at shutting your feelings off, thereby cooling the 
thought-temperature, the UV would be less pressing. As you said, the 
tower scene, with dying DD, Draco, the De, hiding Harry, DD pleading 
and the trigger words, would hardly leave any room for choice. 
Still, IMO DD's pleading suggests, that Snape had some choice in 
what to do – I suppose on the risk of sacrificing himself with the 
UV getting out of his control.

>Ceridwen:
>It would be interesting to talk about what Dark Magic might be. I'm
>sure we all have ideas!

Orna:
Would be interested to hear about it. Some thoughts – It has to do 
with generally harming yourself as a whole person, and harming the 
other person as a whole human being. The supreme dark magic has to 
do with splitting your soul – killing and horcruxing.
On a lesser level - The crucio curse works only if you mean it; 
enjoy enforcing pain on someone, thereby shutting yourself from 
compassion, feeling for the other. It's important that just being 
angry and revengeful – doesn't work there. It's a very human 
feeling, which does leave room for other feelings to emerge. 

The UV doesn't only limit your choices – it prevents you from 
rethinking your deeds, transforming. As I understand Arthur's anger –
 it seems that once the vow is taken, there isn't a simple 
possibility of "undoing", even if both parties agree.

That's for now,

Orna