Pensive Peeking - & it's Dymanics

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 124108


--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Tonks" <tonks_op at y...> wrote:
> 
> As far as what the owner of the Pensieve sees relative to what Harry
> saw, I think it happens in realtime. When Dumbledore join Harry in 
> the courtroom memory, he only saw what Harry saw from the time 
> Dumbledore joined him until the both existed the memory.
> 

 
> Tonks:
> 
> Sorry I don't have my book handy. Did Snape look into the pensive to 
> see how far Harry had gotten into the memeory?  If not and he just 
> comes into the room and catches Harry with his head in the pensive 
> and pulls Harry out, how would Snape know if Harry saw just the 
> first few seconds or all say 10 minutes of it? What I am trying to 
> say is that unless Snape looked, and I don't remember that he did, 
> maybe he thinks Harry saw more than Harry actually did.
> 
> Tonks_op

bboyminn:

I see by your other post that you did dig out your books and reread
that scene. The thing to remember is that we see the scene from
Harry's perspective. We see nothing of Snape until Harry also see him,
so all Snape's actions are 'off-page'. 

Because of this, we can't say what Snape did or didn't do. Snape may
have paused long enough to find out what Harry was looking at before
he made physical contact, and by doing so, made his presence known to
Harry. 

So, there is no accurate way to determine how long Snape watched or
how much he saw; we are reduced to speculation. That said, it seems a
reasonable speculation that Snape paused and looked long enough to
determine what memory Harry was looking at. 

Further, it would be reasonable for Snape to assume that Harry had
been wandering through his memories from the time Snape left the room.

As to that one specific memory, all Snape needs to see is enough to
determine which memory it is, and that would sufficient information
for Snape's humiliation and anger. 

In addition to the anger and embarassment surrounding that one memory,
Snape has plenty of reason to be furious at Harry. It is fairly
unthinkable, unreasonable, and wholly inappropriate that a student
would violate his privacy in such an egregious way.

Of course, I understand why Harry did it, and I can't say I wouldn't
have done the same, but Snape is fully justified in his anger at Harry
in this incident.

Short version- I say again that it all happens in realtime. Snape
knows which memory Harry is viewing, and can reasonably assume Harry
as been viewing for an extended period of time, and therefore, most
likely saw the entire memory up to the point where it is interupted.

As to how much Snape saw, he certainly only saw the end of that
memory, but it's difficult to say how long he watched before he
interupted Harry. I think it's pretty fair speculation to say that
Snape didn't stand an observe for very long. He has ample reason to be
angry, even furious, without knowing which memory Harry was viewing at
the moment. That anger wouldn't have held him at bay very long.

Finally, I stand by my statement, that it is the mind that enters the
Pensieve and not the body. Harry's physical presents in the memory is
his own consciousness and self-awareness that has joined with the
memory. His self-awareness causes the preceived physical manifestation
of his 'Self'.

What Snape did see was obtained by more sophisticated use of the
Pensieve than Harry's 'stick your face in it' method. First and most
obvious would be to simply look into the Pensieve as if you were
looking through a window. I also speculated the putting his wand or
his finger into the Pensieve would give him a more complete experience
than 'looking through the window'.

..rambled a bit, hope your answer is in here somewhere.

Steve/bboyminn