On negotiating with giants, etc. (was: Dumbledore the General)

[hogsheadbarmaid]

No: HPFGUIDX 124274



> Nicky Joe:
> > My chief irritation with DD is that he had FIFTEEN years to plan 
> > for LV's return.  Couldn't he have spent a couple hours of that 
> > fifteen  years making a few plans?  Hmmm, let's say Voldemort 
> > returns to full strength one day.  What shall we do?  I know, let's 
> > wait around and hope that little Harry grows up to be a big strong 
> > wizard that can take him out - oh wait, we already know that 
> > happens because the prophecy says so.  Great!  We'll just sit here 
> > and eat some candies. 
>  
> Alla:
> > MAHAHAHA! Very good point,which I did not even consider properly. 
> > Dumbledore tells Harry himself that he did not believe that Voldie 
> > was gone forever fifteen years ago.
> > 
> > So, all those negotiations with giants, etc. should have been 
> > started MUCH earlier than they did ( although maybe DD tried to do 
> > so and we are not aware of it yet)
> 
> 
> SSSusan:
> I have a question for either of you (or anybody else for that 
> matter).  Do you think that entering into negotiations with giants or 
> centaurs or goblins or any other group would have had a very high 
> likelihood of success if everyone believed Voldy was gone for good?  
> 
> I really think that DD and Hagrid may have been in a very small 
> minority of people who thought Voldy would manage to return someday 
> [do we know about any others?].  What evidence was there for a 
> potential return, given that he seemed to have been vaporized, and 
> years began to pass by with no news of him?  To me, if I were a 
> member of one of the groups approached by DD, I'd be skeptical at 
> best and would wonder why we even needed to talk about the matter.  
> 
> I think DD's hands were more tied on this issue than it might at 
> first appear, until evidence of Voldy's return appeared.  And note 
> that, once it did, Hagrid was despatched immediately to the giants.
> 
> Siriusly Snapey Susan


Barmaid now:

I had not really thought much about this before, but what you say,
SSSusan, makes a lot of sense.  In fact, it has to be true that most
people _really_ did not believe LV even could come back -- it had to
be totally out of the realm of possibility for most people -- in order
for  them to so completely discount both DD and Harry's assertions
that he _had_ in fact returned.  I think I have been seeing it as more
evenly split, and more about smart, aware people knowing he (LV) would
return and stupid, self-absorbed people not seeing it.  But really it
makes much more sense that it would be held as _Common Knowledge_ that
LV had been defeated once and for all.

That said... there are still problems with DD.  Sometimes he seems to
have so much knowledge and so much power that he really could
accomplish whatever he wanted to.  Other times he seems to be easily
thwarted.  Bit of a puzzle.

    --Barmaid