Method- communication- Patronus vs Little Birdie

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 122581


--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, chnc1024 at A... wrote:
>  
> In a message dated 1/20/2005 5:45:40 PM Pacific Standard Time,  
> vmonte at y... writes:
> 
> JLV  here:
> I definitely agree that the Patronus is the most likely  candidate
> for being the method of communication that the Order  use.
> 
> 
> 
> *************************************************
>  
> Chancie:
>  
> Reasons I don't believe a Patronus is the answer:
>  
> 1.  Harry is told that the Patronus charm is VERY difficult.
>  
> 2.  I don't remember .. that they make sound, so how
>     can they deliver a message?
>  
> 3.  How could a witch or wizard send a Patronus ...,
>      without it being seen by a muggle or possibly even  a DE?
>  
> 4.  How would a witch or wizard beable to keep the Patronus from 
>      disapearing? ...
>  
> It just seems to me that there has to be an easier way to send  
> messages!
>
> If anyone can prove me wrong, please do!


bboyminn:

Well, I think the Patronus Charm is a logical assumption, but I think
it is wrong.

The Patronus is suspected because when Dumbledore found Krum stunned,
he cast a spell that sent something slivery and almost bird-like
flying of to Hagrid's cabin.

True, Patronus's are slivery and usually animal-like, in addition, we
have been told by JKR that Dumbledore's Patronus is indeed a Phoenix,
so that creates a bird connection, but I none the less think it is wrong.

As Chancie pointed out, Patronus's are fleeting, they don't last long.
As soon as the Dementor threat is gone, the Patronus vanishes.

Also, no indication that they can talk, which would impede their
ability to deliver messages.

So, what's my theory? 

Ever heard the expression, '...a little birdie told me'?

I think we are seeing a very specific Message Charm that I will dub
the 'little birdie charm'. The idea of using birds to deliver messages
is well represented. Owls are the most obvious, but let's not forget
messenger pigeons that were frequently used in the real world to
deliver messages. Just as with messenger pigeons, I think the 'Birdie'
charm is limited to short and to the point messages. Anything more
complicated must be delivered by some other means.

Let's not forget that the Order also has ghosts and living portraits
available to deliver more complex messages. Those would be very
effective means. I also think ghosts would make very effective spies.

So, I do agree, the spell Dumbledore used to summon Hagrid is the
spell that JKR is referring to, but I'm not convinced it's a Patronus
Charm. At the same time, as I acknowledged above, the Messenger Charm
is somewhat Patronus like in appearance.

If it was a true Patronus, then I think it operated in a limited
context. It could be that if Dumbledore did indeed cast a Patronus to
summon Hagrid, that the Patronus didn't actually deliver a message.
It's conceivable that Dumbledore merely sent a symbol, a phoenix, that
Hagrid would recognise as representing Dumbledore, and divined the
location of the problem by nothing more than the direction from which
the Patronus came. 

Just a thought.

Steve/bboyminn (was bboy_mn)