THE LILY & JAMES ALCHEMIST THEORY

[templar1112002]

No: HPFGUIDX 131941

"tinglinger" wrote:
> Here is my latest theory that can explain a lot of what happened
> during the time of the First Wizard War and events leading up to 
> the death of the Potters.....
<snip> 
> So.... since Dumbledore and Flamel are partners it is not
> unreasonable to conjecture that -
> a- Dumbledore now also knows how to make the stone - Flamel
> taught him
> b- There may be more than just "the one stone currently in
> existence" - that was at the time of the old book, not now.
> How does this play out? Please read on.....
> 
> IMPLICATIONS FOR JAMES LILY AND HARRY
> THE LILY & JAMES ALCHEMIST THEORY
> --------------------------------------------
<snip>
5. Dumbledore had a plan that he had tried once before
with mixed results (more on this later .....). Remember that
the second property of the Sorcerer's stone is that "It also
produced the Elixir of Life, which will make the drinker
immortal". Now what if Harry was given the Elixir of Life,
and Voldemort has this prophecy that he heard about Harry,
and he tries to kill Harry who now is immortal ---- what
would happen to the target of that spell -- or its caster???
An irresistable force against an immovable object........
an AK cast on an eternal being !!!!! Would that spell not
create an effect similar to a priori incantatum - or better
yet, rebound automatically on the caster?
So in other words, Dumbledore set a trap for Voldemort --
Harry always was the intended target (or more accurately the
weapon). Dumbledore defeats the dark wizard and the Wizarding
world is saved. But something goes horribly wrong and James
and Lily are killed - despite Hagrid's rant

CAR CRASH! roared Hagrid, .... How could a car crash kill Lily an'
James? It's an outrage! A scandal.
If only he knew..... or did he?

And Harry survives as a boy, but a boy who is alchemistically
enhanced. Enhanced in such a way that he must be kept away from
wizards until he is ready to deal with it - an isolated
super-wizard.

So now you have the Lily & James are Alchemists Theory
as described above, and here is why it makes even more sense.......

You might ask why James and Lily would agree to such a thing?
Even for all the gold in Gringot's! Two reasons.
First, the wizarding world and the order are doomed if nothing is
done, and second BECAUSE DUMBLEDORE HAS DONE IT ALL BEFORE AND
SUCCEEDED..... almost. 
> So now you have the Lily & James are Alchemists Theory
> as described above, and here is why it makes even more sense.......
> 
> You might ask why James and Lily would agree to such a thing?
> Even for all the gold in Gringot's! Two reasons.
> First, the wizarding world and the order are doomed if nothing is
> done, and second BECAUSE DUMBLEDORE HAS DONE IT ALL BEFORE AND
> SUCCEEDED..... almost.



**Marcela now:  While I don't quite agree with your theory of 
Dumbledore training Lily and James as apprentices, it is fact that 
Harry Potter *is* the "philosophical child" in alchemical imagery -
more on that following below.  But first I'll address the reason for 
my disagreement: the prophecy was known a few months/days before 
Harry was born, how on earth could Dumbledore, James and Lily have 
predicted such?  What about the part of Dumbledore's explanation in 
OoTP, about him not being sure which of the boys was the prophecized 
one? (Harry or Neville?).  Unless there was a previous prophecy (not 
by S.Trelawny, perhaps her ancestor's?), it would have been very 
odd/unrealistic for James and Lily to make such a deal with 
Dumbledore, it sounds way too machiavelian for anybody's taste... 
(it would be like the infamous "I'm your father" in the Star Wars 
story, :))  And according to your theory, Harry would not be the 
product of Love, but of Calculation...

Now I'll quote parts from "A Dictionary of Alchemical Imagery", by 
Lindy Abraham.  So warning alert...

Philosophical Child: the philosopher's stone when it is first bron 
fromt he union of Sol and Luna at the chemical wedding. ... The 
Stone is known as the orphan and the alchemist plays the role of its 
foster-parent.  During the cibation, the alchemist must gradually 
nourish the infant Stone with 'milk' and 'meat' (the white and red 
mercurial waters) so that it may become sweet and strong.  When it 
has grown to maturity this infant has the power to conquer all 
disease and transform all things to perfection.  Arthur Dee wrote of 
the infant Stone's maturation into the spiritual warrior: 'he will 
become a king, stronger than a king, and so stout in Battell, that 
he alone being a most powerful Conqueror, will obtain the Victory 
against ten thousand Enemies' (FC,110).

Also, in same book but about the Philosopher's Stone:  It is 
generally thought that the elixir and philospher's stone are of the 
same essence, the elixir being in liquid form, the Stone being in 
solid or powder form.  ... The Stone is endowed with many names, 
some of which are: elixir, tinture, medicine, panacea, balsam, 
arcanum, quintessence, tree, rose, lily, hyacinth, east, morning, 
living fountain, white stone, red stone, ruby, crystal, diamond, 
sapphire, Adam, paradise, Sophia, hermaphrodite, man, red king, red 
lion, microcosm, salvator, servator, filius macrocosmi, homunculus, 
sun, son, daughter, orphan, bird, Hermes bird and phoenix.  John 
Read has suggested that the alchemical authors seem to have regarded 
it as 'a mark of their originality to advance a new name for the 
Stone'. ... The Scala philosophorum stated: 'The Stone is one: Yet 
this one is not one in Number, but in kind.'

To end with the quoting.  About the Chemical wedding, or the union 
of Red Man/King/Sol and White woman/Queen/Luna: "the philosopher's 
Stone cannot be generated until the lovers have died and their 
bodies putrefied in the mercurial waters.  Artephius wrote of the 
lovers: 'If therefore these do not die, and be converted into water, 
they remain alone, or as they were and without fruit; that if they 
die, and are resolved in our water, they bring forth fruit, an 
hundred fold'.  The bodies of the lovers lying dead in the grave 
symbolize the death which frees the soul to be released and rise to 
the top of the alembic.


So, if we allow your theory about Dumbledore, James and Lily sort of 
planning on producing a philosopher's child, I'm afraid that 
the 'dying' part of James and Lily was not an accident or something 
that went wrong, but *part of* the plan.  This could explain the 
reason why Dumbledore had 'powers' to take Harry to Privet Drive and 
then control his education, he is the alchemist/philosopher/foster-
parent, he sees that the "orphan" grows up and is burnt/fed in the 
three alchemical Fires: Natural, not Natural and against Nature.  
The first and second fires produce the Nigredo and Albedo stages, 
which IMO Harry has just gone through... so what's left is the third 
fire, is it called 'against Nature' because it's water, it's the 
fountain of living water, mercurial water.  Perhaps that boat in the 
cover of HBP might signify this stage?
IMHO, Dumbledore just picked up the process once Harry was hit with 
the AK, there was no planning of making him a Stone.  Dumbledore has 
stated many times that he's not sure what happened at Godric's 
Hollow on that fated Hallowe'en night, he's working on educated 
guesses...

Marcela