Sirius and Prank again? Fools Rush in where Wisemen Fear to Go

[a_svirn]

No: HPFGUIDX 129878

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Steve" <bboyminn at y...> wrote:
> --- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "dumbledore11214"
> <dumbledore11214 at y...> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > a_svirn:
> > 
> > And although I would agree that Sirius's actions and motivations 
are 
> > far from clear, two things at least are given: he did try to 
kill 
> > Snape and he did betray Lupin in the process. ...
>  
>  
> > Alla:
> > 
> > ... the only thing which is sort of a given to me only of course 
is 
> > that Sirius told SOMEBODY how to get to Shrieking Shack and 
Snape 
> > heard it. ... 
> >
> > I said earlier that I absolutely cannot imagine Snape listening 
to 
> > what Sirius said and believing it and DOING what Sirius told him 
to 
> > do.
> > 
> > Whom Sirius said it to, whether he said it in a staged 
conversation 
> > or not, why he said it, what was Remus role in the events and 
many 
> > other things are not clear at all, to me only, of course.
> > 
> > JMO of course,
> > 
> > Alla
> 
> bboyminn:
> 
> A couple points, although I too dread a rehash of this about as 
much
> as a dread another time turner discussion. 
> 
> We know that, through Sirius, Snape found out how to get into the
> Whomping Willow. It is implied that Sirius did this intentionally. 
But
> as Alla implies, Sirius could have done this through an 
unnecessarily
> loud conversation that he knew Snape was overhearing. In this case,
> while Sirius is somewhat responsible for instigating the events, it
> was Snape's own actions that put him at risk. Yes, Sirius intended 
for
> it to go the way it did, but it was Snape's choice to act.
> 
> As an alternative, Sirius may have applied some reverse psychology 
by
> first directly telling Snape how to get into the Whomping Willow, 
then
> telling him that it was a dangerous and deadly thing to do. Further
> assuring him that he would die a terrible death if he acted on that
> information. (I have the whole scenario worked out, if you would 
like
> it with quotes, but I'm sure you get the idea and can make up your 
own
> dialog.) To a 15/16 year old boy, 'if you do this you will die', is
> more of a challange than a deterrent. Yet it does leave Sirius 
with an
> ever-so-lovely 'plausible deniability'. 
> 
> Sirius can always say after the fact that he warned Snape not to 
go,
> and told him that it was deadly dangerous. In the cold light of
> after-the-fact analysis, this would seem like a fair and reasonable
> warning. However, to two rival schoolboys, they would see it for
> exactly what it was, a goading of one by the other. This also helps
> explain why the punishment was as mild as it was. Sirius had 
certainly
> broken several rules and put his classmate into danger, but Sirius 
did
> warn Snape not to go, so again the ever-so-lovely 'plausible 
deniability'.
> 
> So, we can reasonably suspect that this was a trick Sirius was 
playing
> on Snape, but part of the trick could have been that Snape's own
> stubborn determination and pig-headedness would be the actual thing
> that put Snape in danger.
> 
> Further, it is only by Snape's assertion that we are told that 
Sirius
> literally tried to kill Snape. One could speculate that in Sirius's
> mind, once Snape saw what was there in the Shack, he would turn 
tail
> and run faster than a bullet. Being the erogant shortsighted 
teenager
> that he was, it is very likely that Sirius never thought it through
> and never realized what a terrible position, he was putting Lupin 
in,
> or what a position he was putting Snape in. Some will choose to see
> that as out and out evil, but sadly that's very close to normal
> teenage male behavior. Teen male are not noted for being the most 
deep
> thinking or far thinking creatures on this earth.
> 
> So we can fairly and reasonable accept that this was a VERY BAD 
thing
> for Sirius to do, and that Sirius intended for it to happen, 
however,
> without the exact details of the events and what lead up to them, 
we
> can make no real claims of evil intent or attempted murder.
> 
> Snape's anger could just as easily stem from having been made a 
fool
> of, as from having his life put at risk. The 'I told you not to go'
> scenario would work nicely for Snape having been made a fool of.
> 
> Just a few thoughts.
> 
> Steve/bboyminn


Whether Sirius said it outright, or staged the conversation for 
Snape to overhear, doesn't really matter, now does it? He did intend 
to feed him to a werewolf and how he'd brought it about is of a 
secondary importance. Was it a prank or a murder attempt? Depends of 
your idea of fun, I suppose. But what I find more disturbing about 
the whole business is the fact that he tried to use his friend to do 
his dirty work for him, to turn Lupin's misfortune to his advantage. 
He betrayed Lupin in every possible sense, unless of course Lupin 
was in on a joke which is highly improbable. 

a_svirn