Hermione's a liberal

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 125467


 
Kathryn:
 
Hermione should concentrate on making sure the house elves have a 
choice about whether they follow the particular 'rules'of their 
culture or whether they choose to live outside of them like Dobby. 
Rather than trying to take that choice from them. Hermione is no 
more allowing the Elves free will than the rest of the wizarding 
world. 

<SNIP>

Alla:

Fair enough, but don't you think that in some very limited 
circumstances freedom of choice should not be the prevailing 
criteria for the action?

For example, let's assume that ALL house-elves are tortured on a 
regular basis in every wizarding home. Now, there is no reason to 
think that they are treated particularly well ( Dobby is a good 
example), but according to Dobby situation is sort of improved since 
Voldemort's defeat.

Suppose situation got much worse and house elves are subjected to 
horrible physical pain every day. Nevertheless for some reason they 
like it ( they got used to it,whatever). Do you think that if 
Hermione has means to free them, she should act on them, even if 
house elves don't want it now? I mean I am not 100% certain, but I 
tend to lean to POV that in such hypothetical Hermione should act 
first and educate house elves later, because  no objective bystander 
will object to the fact that torture is NOT good for anybody.

Now, that is not what happens in the books and I do think that 
Hermione will grew up and adjust her strategy, but I wonder.

Kemper now:

I need to clarify
 I don't think her liberal/progressive values
are 
unethical.  I think taking away another's choice is.  But I don't 
think Hermione realizes that is what she's doing.  When she does, I 
think she will take a different tactic for elf-rights.  Perhaps 
meeting with Doby and having him approach House Elves who 
are `enslaved' in some abusive  homes.  <SNIP>  It would 
be unfair to the House Elves to free them and then not guide them to 
a culture of freedom.  There might be chaos.  Hermione can't 
revolutionize a culture over night.  Change is a process not an 
event.

Alla:

Oh, I agree completely with this statement of yours. hermione 
definitely needs to change the methods. I just have no doubt that 
her heart is in a right place.

Kemper now:
 
I'm not arguing Hermione's lack of tolerance; I'm arguing her lack 
of consideration towards a people who have a seemingly unchanged 
culture that has continued for centuries.  
 
I consider Hermione a liberal as you have well defined it.  But 
again, she could use a mentor.

Alla:

Hm, to play a devil advocate a little bit on the subject of 
Hermione's tolerance which is unrelated to house elves. It was 
brought up somewhere in the old discussion maybe by Elkins or by 
someone else.

"NO!" Hermione screamed. "Harry, don't trust him, he's been helping 
Black get into the castle, he wants you dead too - he's a 
werewolf!" - PoA, p.345, paperback.

Now, this occurence was brought up to show Hermione's intolerance to 
werewolves. Do you agree? Personally I tend to think that the fact 
that Hermione was covering up Remus' secret all year shows her 
tolerance more truthfully that behaviour in the Shack,when 
everybody's emotions run high and everybody says things they may not 
mean at all.


Although I have to admit that Hermione's remark about Firenze makes 
me wonder a little.


 
Kemper
Thanking Alla for the opportunity to expound on the thread.

Alla: 

Happy to oblige. :o)

Just my opinion,

Alla