Annoyed with Harry

[Steve]

No: HPFGUIDX 129441

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "rbookworm46" <rbookworm46 at y...>
wrote:
> Magda:
> - He doesn't appreciate his friends enough.
> - ...it's amazing how clueless he can be about the big picture.

 
> Kemper:
> I think Magda points out Harry's character flaws well. To sum her
> points: He's generally inconsiderate and self involved. 

 
> Bookworm:
> Of course he is inconsiderate and self-involved.  He is a teenager.  
> 
> The same goes for most of Magda's points. ...  Let's see:
> 
> -Doesn't appreciate friends: Just this week, one of my
> daughter's friends told another that she hated her, ... The reason?
> Mary couldn't find her pencil and accused Jane of stealing it.  
> 
> -Clueless: Is there a parent who doesn't agree?  The same kid who 
> can memorize the lyrics to an entire album can't remember what
> they studied in school earlier in the day,......
> 
> -Protective shields: A natural response to hurt.  
> 
> ...edited...
> 
> Inconsiderate and self involved?  It's a wonder if that is the worst 
> that is said about Harry.
> 
> Ravenclaw Bookworm

bboyminn:

I think Ravenclaw Bookworm is right on in her statements and examples
of the motivation behind Harry's behavior, but I think it goes much
deeper than that.

I think Harry's personality and his action are very much explainable
and justifiable given his upbringing. Harry grew up in an abusive
household. Please, let's not go into another discussion of whether or
not Harry was 'abused'. Regardless of the exact definition of what
happened to him, it was a very oppressive, sometimes dangerous, and
generally anti-Harry household.

-Harry doesn't talk to, ask questions of, or confide in anyone.

Naturely, he doesn't, his earlier life has taught him that adults are
irrational, unreasonable, meanspirited, and dangerous people. More
importantly, this early experience is ingrained into his subconscious,
and the subconscious knowledge far outweighs the intellectual
knowledge he has gained since leaving the Dursley. There is a reason
they call these earlier years the 'formative' years.

-Harry has a very small circle of friends and an equally small circle
or people he trusts.

Sure Harry generally and superficially trust Dean and Seamus, but they
are not people he trust on a deeply personal level. Even with Ron and
Hermione, the people he trust most in the world, he still holds back.
Why? Because his formative years have taught him that people are
dangerous, irrational, and can't be trusted. Kids at school shunned
him, and stood by and laugh while Dudley and his gang abused him.
Again, these are deeply ingrained attitudes that aren't easily
overridden by intellect. If they were, a lot of psychiatrists would be
out of business.

-Harry is independant. If something needs to be done, he prefers to do
it himself.

When Harry decided to go after the Stone, he is somewhat shocked that
 Ron and Hermione are planning to go along. He doesn't make allowances
for other people to help because never in his earlier life was there
every anyone there he could trust or count on to help. This is deeply
ingrained learned behavior.

Along with this is that Harry isn't very sensitive to other people's
feeling, and by extension, he is not very good at reading other
people's moods. Of course, he isn't, Harry was the prey and the rest
of the world was the predator, and to a significant extent that is
still going on. Harry doesn't have time to weigh other people's
attitudes, he is busy summoning all the cunning and guile he can
muster in order to survive. When you have been preyed upon you whole
life, you learn very quickly that the only person you can count on is
yourself, and that's just what Harry does. 

Usually when I bring this up, people point out the surely Harry can
trust Ron and Hermione, surely he respects and trusts Dumbledore,
surely all his new experiences since he came to Hogwarts have taught
him that there are good and safe people in the world, and they would
be right, but only within very limiting boundaries. What happened in
the first 11 years of Harry's life is ingrained in him forever. These
are traits and characteristics that adults stuggle to overcome for
their entire lives and frequently never accomplish it completely. 

Those early experiences have formed Harry in a way that he can never
completely overcome. He may with time and supportive friends learn to
work around them, but they are Harry and there is no truly escaping them. 

The new things he's learned since arriving at Hogwarts, these are
mostly intellectual realizations; he knows them in his mind but deep
in his core he doesn't feel them. 

I think JKR has done an extremely fine job of creating a character
that has characteristics that are inescapable given where and how he
grew up and has tempered those negatives with a character that also is
extremely stubborn and self-determined. Someone with a strong enough
sense of self-worth that even at that young age he knew with
confidence that the Dursleys were wrong about him. She has created a
character that has a striking, and strikingly positive, blend of the
dark that life has forced on him coupled with the unwavering light of
good that exists within him.

>From Harry not asking questions to his seeming unawareness of other
people's feelings, I think can all be explained by his earlier life at
the Dursleys, and given how dark and terrible that life was, I think
through strength of character, a remarkably unscathed and unscarred
boy/man has emerged. 

He does have his faults, but overall, he is a remarkably good kid.

Steve/bboyminn