What is poetic justice? WAS: Re: Snape-the Hero -- Snape-the Abuser

[quigonginger]

No: HPFGUIDX 143344

> > Alla:
> 
> > Again, I interpret " vicarious retribution" as retribution for 
> > something bad which character did, but terms of the story will 
not 
> > let the author punish the character directly.
> 
> a_svirn:
> And how do you interpret the word *vicarious*?  
> 
> >Alla: 
> > Let's look at Dudley. Hagrid indeed gave him a pig tail because 
he 
> > was mad at Vernon ( quite deservingly, I'd say, but of course 
> Hagrid 
> > should have done it to Vernon), BUT I can also interpret Hagrid 
> > doing to Dudley as carmic retribution for all those years 
> of "Harry 
> > hunting" Dudley and gang engaged in.
> 
> a_svirn:
> I don't know about "karmic", but in this instance "vicarious" would 
> be a perfectly right term. Because Hagrid used Dudley vicariously: 
> as a substitute for Vernon.

Ginger adds, as a clarification:

I kind of coined the phrase "vicarious retribution" as Alla applies 
it.  To put it in a nutshell, poetic justice is within the story.  
Vicarious retribution is for the reader.

VR is like Dudley and the pig's tail.  He didn't do anything to 
deserve the pig's tail from Hagrid, but we the readers know that he's 
been a nasty little prick to Harry for the last decade.  He gets 
what's coming to him, not for the situation at that moment, but for 
what he has done for the last decade.  

That's also karmic (as I understand it), but the general idea behind 
VR is more pointed at the reader than the character.  We know Dudders 
is a prat, so we (at least those of us who like comeuppance humour) 
will get a kick out of it.  It is there more for us than to move the 
story along or anything like that.  

We get the vicarious thrill that there has been retribution done for 
the previous misdeeds of the character, whether that person deserved 
it at that moment or not.  

Does that make it clear?  The three do have a lot of overlap.

Not sure that added anything, but just in the interest of 
clarification.
Ginger, hoping everyone has a wonderful day, unless they have other 
plans.