Harry's emotions his strength or his weakness? WAS: Re: Dumbledore's pleading

[M.Clifford]

No: HPFGUIDX 141564


> > Carol responds:
> > I'm equally confident that Harry *must* follow Snape's advice
> > -stay away from Dark magic, close your mouth (nonverbal spells),
> > and control your emotions. 
> > Yes, a particular emotion (love) is the key to defeating 
> > Voldemort, but he's not going to find that path by Crucioing 
> > people and seeking revenge.
> 
> Alla:
>
> IF for the sake of argument I will agree that Snape WAS giving 
> advice, which I am not sure about in the first place, I will have to 
> disagree again at least about  the last part. "Controlling his 
> emotions" is a question of degree, IMO and actually I don't remember 
> Snape saying that Harry should control his emotions, more like 
> shutting them down , if I remember the gist of what he was saying 
> during Occlumency lessons and I don't think that "shutting emotions 
> down" is the way to go for Harry.
> 
> Be a bit more in charge, maybe? Being cold and emotionless, I 
> seriously doubt it.


Valky:
If there be no objections, may I sidetrack this discussion slightly?
It occurred to me that having had success before comparing the Under
the Trapdoor foreshadowings to their respective books, that to some
degree it would be prudent to compare these last few chapters of HBP
to the Potions challenge under the trapdoor. And hence when the
context is overlaid on upon the other, after this um.. discussion?
between Snape and Harry, there is Fire - Hagrids House and DD's burial
- and right before the fires in the UTTD trials there is a discussion
between Harry and Hermione.


So could I bend your ears to compare the two exchanges with me?

The first one is simple and straighforward enough -
Hermione says, you are a great wizard Harry.
Harry replies, not as good as you.
Hermione then, Who.. me.. Books and cleverness, there are more
important things, like friendship, bravery and Oh Harry Be Careful!

The second exchange, between Snape and Harry, something like this -
Cruc-, Cruc-
No Unforgivables from you Potter you don't have the nerve or the
ability - parrying curses..
Incarc- Fight Back! Coward!
Who me, Your father never fought me without help what would you call
him then? still parrying curses.
Blocked until you can keep your mind closed and mouth shut.
Then Snape saves him from being crucio'ed
Harry uses Snapes curses, Snape gets mad - MY book MY Cleverness!, and
Harry calls him Coward.
DON'T CALL ME COWARD!

So what are the similarities?

Well one way to read it stands out for me pretty well like a green
orange. 

PS/SS - I am not as good as You.
HBP - Harry is not as good as Snape.

PS/SS - Who ME. Books and Cleverness.
Snape taking the credit for HIS book HIS Cleverness.

PS/SS - There are more important things, Friendship, Bravery and Oh
Harry be careful...

Now heres the hard part. Theres a list of elements in the exchange
between Snape and Harry that seem to fit the elements of this sentence
but most need to be ripped out of context to do it. The ones that fit
best IMO are:

Friendship - No Unforgivables for you, Potter! 
Bravery - Don't call me Coward.
and Harry be careful - Close your mind, Shut your Mouth. 

The problem is that Snape says this all in mixed order in comparison
to what Hermione says.

Other elements that fit but not as well in the context of the PS/SS
scene IMO are:

Friendship: Snape protecting Draco, Harry saying NOt Hagrid too! and
Your father fought me two on one what would you call that? 
Bravery: Your father fought me two on one etc.., Harry feeling no Fear
and Harry be careful: Snape protecting him from Crucio, and parrying
the curses..


Now here's where I say, how much I agree with Alla. <g>
As I see it, the three main things that Snape says respective to
Hermiones advice are - No Unforgivables, Don't call me Coward and
Close your mind shut your mouth. 

When it comes down to it in PS/SS, the next trial with the Mirror,
Hermione's advice to be careful is close to good for nothing. Harry
finds the stone, and he does try to conceal it, he does try to be
careful. He decides to lie and pretend he doesn't know where it is,
and this is when Voldemort reveals himself. 

When Harry does finally protect the stone, it is his friendship and
bravery valued above all things that gives him the strength to do the
job right. He stands between Voldemort and his friends (Hogwarts) and
he stays bravely fighting for the stone until he is all but dead from
the effort. Being careful had nothing to do with his victory.

As a foreshadowing, I think it says almost the opposite to what has
been said a lot on these boards. 

Many of us are saying that Harry probably won't take Snapes advice to
play smart and be careful. But I, on the contrary think, it is
foreshadowed that he will. 

Many of us think he won't win without it, and I, on the contrary,
think that it's foreshadowed that his trying to hide his thoughts and
keep his mouth shut will be what leads him to the most danger. And it
will be Friendship, Bravery and Love that makes it possible for him to
win the battle.

Okay, everyone - launch the rotten tomatoes. :D

Valky