Spinner's End as home (wasRe: CHAPDISC: HBP 2, Spinner's End

[potioncat]

No: HPFGUIDX 142147


> Carol responds;
> I can see an adult who can Apparate and Disapparate hiding in plain
> sight. But how is the child Severus supposed to do that? Did he 
spend
> his entire out-of-school life in that dreary bedroom? I can't 
imagine
> him wearing Muggle clothes or going to school with Muggle children.

Potioncat:
For that matter, how did Sirius and Regulus fit into the neighborhood 
at 12GP? We could make an argument that the Weasleys managed to keep 
all their kids close, but they aren't in a city. 


Carol:
 And as I keep saying, Severus came to
> Hogwarts at age eleven knowing more hexes than most seventh years. I
> can't see him coming from a Muggle background or growing up in a
> Muggle neighborhood. The child knew he was a wizard and took 
advantage
> of it, blowing the law against underage magic out of the water.

Potioncat:
As much as we know, Spinner's End can simply be a cheap place Snape 
rented for this summer. He may never have been here before. He may 
rent it every summer; or may have bought it; inherited it; or grew up 
here. It is certainly a wizarding house now. Isn't there a department 
at the MoM that handles real estate that reverts back to Muggle 
ownership?

If it was his Muggle father's home, it gives us some idea of his 
background. It fits with the descriptions I gave earlier and it fits 
with his gray underwear. He appeared to be a poor kid.

Carol:
 He
> must have lived in a home in which magic would go undetected. And to
> me that indicates that he must have lived with the Princes, not with
> Muggle Tobias, who would never have allowed his young son anywhere
> near a wand. And it must have been his mother's wand, or that of
> another adult wizard, that he practiced with.

Potioncat:
Let's think about that. Tobias could be the yelling man. The only way 
I can make that fit would be if Eileen had been expelled from 
Hogwarts and was unable to use magic. That could be, but it takes 
such a leap, I wouldn't offer it as a real theory. 

Tobias could think this magic stuff is just grand, and encourage it.

Tobias could walk out or kick them out.

Snape could grow up mainly at the Prince home or visit the Prince 
home often. I think it's very likely he practiced his magic away from 
his father's Muggle home.


>Carol: 
> I can't see either young Severus or his mother Eileen "hiding in 
plain
> sight," actually, even with Muggle-repelling charms on the house.
> Wouldn't people notice, at the very least, the absence of a TV 
antenna
> and a car in a 1960s house, even if they couldn't tell that the 
house
> was lit by candles rather than electricity? Wouldn't they notice a
> woman or a boy wearing what looked like a priest's cassock or a
> graduation gown? The neighborhood seems deserted *now* and Snape is
> clever enough to conceal his presence, but I really don't see how he
> could have done so as a child.

Potioncat:
Well, I would think that a marriage between a Muggle and witch would 
have some Muggle things and some WW items. So, likely there was a 
telly and a Floo. I'm sure there was electricity, although Eileen may 
have used a lot of candles. Severus may have played with a toy wand 
and a chemistry set. ;-) Eileen must have been comfortable in the 
Muggle world, or how would she have met Tobias? I would bet young 
Severus wore Muggle clothes at least part of the time.

Sydney wrote:
> Because of the bedraggled teen!Snape, whose biting retort to James
> seemed to consist of nothing but a stream of gutter talk, I would 
lump
> all the cultivation-- the accent, the sweeping walk, the better
> posture (although it still can't be that great, JKR does compare him
> to a vulture!), to his late teens.

Potioncat:
Well, you know, most of us--some of us--thought that perhaps Stan 
never attended Hogwarts. I've changed my mind on that. My point 
being, look at his accent! And I'd bet he's a Pureblood. The Weasleys 
don't speak the same way the Malfoys do. Nor does Seamus. Seamus has 
an Irish cousin who is a wizard, so I'll bet his Mum has an Irish 
accent.

So for all we know, Eileen Prince came from a poor wizarding family 
and also had an accent. (Assuming Spinner's End is in Yorkshire.) 
There tends to be a feeling that Eileen came from a genteel wizarding 
family, but we don't know that. I hope it was a bit nicer than the 
Gaunts! (Wonder if Mrs. Gaunt was a Prince?)

But what I'm saying is that Sydney is right about the swearing and 
lack of culture (although Ron often shocks Hermione with his words.) 
It seems to me, Snape has completely rejected his Muggle heritage. He 
even wears a nightshirt rather than pajamas...and he's young enough 
to have worn pajamas as a kid. From the punishments he dishes out, he 
seems to think there is nothing worse than having to do things 
without magic. 

And he rejected a poor background. If his peers included Malfoy and 
the assorted members of the Black family, he'd have lots of role 
models.

I don't remember if the essay by June included a list of movies that 
take place near Yorkshire, but I think "Blow Dry" and "Calendar 
Girls" are two that do. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong or if 
there are others. ("Calendar Girls" doesn't take place in a Mill 
Town.)

Potioncat who does not mean to say that being from Yorkshire is a bad 
thing, just thinking Spinner's End would not be a good place to be 
from...no, come to think of it, it would be a very good place to 
be "from".