Scene with likeable James

[Joe Goodwin]

No: HPFGUIDX 156297

Nikkalmati:

You have brought up a very interesting point about JKR and her way of 
writing. This scene really hits the reader in the gut. After all the build up of 
James being this great guy, we see this? After seeing Dudley harass and 
pummel Harry, we see this from his father? What a shocker, and it is typical of 
JKR to turn our impressions upside down and shake us (and Harry) up.
I can believe that teenaged boys can be aggressive (what are sports for 
after all? ), but not all are bullies. There was a thread several months ago 
about how horrible this experience would be for a teenage boy (Snape). 
   
  Joe: 
   
  Sorry but teenage boys are just that agressive and most do or have done what you call bullying. At different levels certainly but most do it in some form or another.
   
  No offense but I was a teenage boy and I could not fathom how that could be anywhere near the worst memory for Snape. Lots worse happens to boys that age all the time and frankly it made me think even more poorly of Snape than I already did
   
  Nikkalmati:
Someone mentioned the worst humiliation for a boy this age is to be "pantsed" and 
this is what is about to happen in the part we don't see.
   
  Joe:
   
  They were wrong. Very, very wrong.
   
  Nikkalmati:
   Also, having a 
girl come to your rescue would be humiliation in turn. There is no way to 
"spin" this scene as positive for James and Co. JKR even lays it on thicker by 
telling us he hexed other people in the halls and we know he probably has a 
drawer to himself ,or shared with Sirius, in Filch's office. What kind of 
excuse does Sirius give Harry? He says something like - he grew out of it 
(except for Snape, of course). 
   
  Joe:
   
  But we know that lots of students hex each other. Remember in HBP Lupin tells Harry that Levicorpus was very popular in his time. He also goes on to state that "You know that these spells come and go out of fashion." meaning Harry sees it in his times well. Add in all the mentions of people trying to hex the members of various Quidditch teams and it seems pretty clear that JKR was showing us that this scene while perhaps instructive is by no means limited to James and Sirius. She has told us for a fact that students hex each other all the time.


Nikkalmati:
  I think JKR likes to shatter our conceptions of people in her books. I 
expect more of these revelations in Book 7. It is part of the excitement and 
suspense of reading HP. She wants also to show that James was human, but why no 
balancing with a good scene of some kind? I believe his having witnessed 
the memory in the Pensieve will help Harry in Book 7 to reconcile with Snape in 
some way. He did have a momentary sympathy for Snape and think JKR will 
use this memory and also sympathy for Draco to bring Harry to a more tolerant 
and inclusive view of the world, before he smashes LV to a pulp 

Joe:
   
  How so? To show a teenage James hexing Snape is going to cause Harry to forgive Snape for the deaths of his parents or for joining a group of people set on genocide? Or to forgive Draco for Dumbledore's death and Bill's disfigurement?
   
  Exactly how can you draw an equivalence between what amounts to a prank though maybe a mean spirited one and several other actions that lead to the deaths of others? Both Snape and Draco knew that working for Voldemort would lead to peoples deaths and trying to draw any paralell between that and James being a bit stupid is ridiculous.
   
  It is like saying I should forgive my wife for shooting me because I left the toliet seat up.
   
  Joe







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