Spinner's End

[wynnleaf]

No: HPFGUIDX 156743


> Carol responds:
> Impact or not, I can't reconcile Severus's growing up in a Muggle
> neighborhood with knowing all those hexes, invented or not. Even if
> the restriction on underage magic wasn't in effect when Severus 
was a
> child, the Statute of Secrecy certainly was, and all those hexes 
being
> performed in a Muggle neighborhood would certainly have been 
detected,
> particularly if he hexed a Muggle. And Severus certainly identifies
> with the Prince side of his family, which suggests, though it 
doesn't
> prove, that he grew up with them--maybe as a kind of stepchild, the
> *half-blood* Prince among the pure-bloods, which would explain the 
air
> of neglect that Harry notes in the Pensieve memory and even the
> greying underpants. If the Princes were like the Blacks, maybe they
> didn't care about such things. Theri money would have been better
> spent (in their view) on Dark artifacts. There's no indication that
> Severus wore second-hand robes or any suggestion that his family 
was
> as poor as the Weasleys.
> 
> I can't see young Severus dressing as a Muggle and attending a 
Muggle
> school. (It's another matter for the adult Snape, who can Apparate 
and 
> place anti-Muggle spells on his house, to hide there.) And having 
one
> Potions book that belonged to his mother doesn't that all of his 
books
> were second hand. Maybe a love of books runs in the family and he
> inherited his mother's books--or the Prince family library. One 
things
> for sure--those books didn't belong to Tobias. And Muggle houses in
> industrial neighborhoods don't usually have wall-to-wall 
bookshelves
> or magically hidden doors.
> 
> The house doesn't reveal anything about his childhood background. 
All
> we learn about his background in HBP is that his witch mother 
married
> a Muggle (which Hermione must have deduced, as someone said, from
> Tobias's occupation and address as listed in the wedding
> announcement). The idea that Spinner's End is his childhood home 
is an
> assumption, and to me it makes no sense given all the hexes, which 
it
> would have been much easier to learn, and much safer given the 
MoM's
> methods of detecting illegal magic, to practice them in a house 
full
> of pureblood wizards, Dark or otherwise, than in a Muggle
> neighborhood, where he would easily get caught. And the magical
> bookshelves are also a bit hard to explain in a Muggle house.
> 
> Why should we care whether Spinner's End was Severus's childhood 
home?
> I have no idea. I just do.
> 
> Carol, who still thinks that Snape bought the place as an adult and
> fixed it up to suit his tastes as a bachelor wizard who spent a 
lot of
> time reading and not much time cleaning house
>

wynnleaf
My impression is that the biggest problem for you with Snape growing 
up in a working class muggle neighborhood is Sirius' (or Lupin's?) 
assertion that he came to school knowing more jinxes and hexes than 
7th years.  Note that in that comment, it wasn't that Snape came to 
school knowing more Dark Magic, but more jinxes and hexes.  In 
another comment, Sirius and Lupin say that Snape was always really 
into the Dark Arts.  But we are not told that he came to school 
knowing lots of Dark Arts, just more hexes, etc.

Now my problem with this comment is that it is information we only 
get from Marauders.  Sirius and Lupin, and in particular Lupin, 
later acknowledge that their actions toward Snape were not right, 
but in general they try to justify their attitude toward Snape by 
saying that he hated them, never missed an opportunity to hex them 
(or James), gave as good as he got, etc.  I don't have my books 
here, but as I recall the comment about Snape knowing all the hexes 
and jinxes as a 1st year was not made in conjunction with 
justifications for their treatment of Snape.  Nevertheless, I think 
that the adult Marauders had a general tendency to try to view the 
school-age Snape in as much a "he deserved it," "he asked for it," 
and "we were justified in considering him an enemy from Day One," 
kind of way.  I would think that from the early part of their school 
days, the Marauders would sometimes have some sort of conscious 
stricken moments when they'd have to justify their attitude toward 
Snape.  Part of that would include reassuring themselves that Snape 
was always bad, came to school bad, etc.  

In real life, I probably wouldn't consider people like Lupin and 
Sirius to have a realistic "take" on their childhood enemy.  I'd 
think that they'd developed their own sort of mythos of Snape, which 
helped them feel better about their actions toward him.  

Of course, Snape's later actions of engaging in hexing matches with 
them, getting really interested in the Dark Arts, and eventually 
becoming a Death Eater, would all add to their viewpoint and tend to 
justify whatever they'd told themselves about him early on.

But I don't put a great deal of stock into a Marauder's evaluation --
 over 20 years later -- of 11 year old Snape's knowledge of hexes.  

In any case, even if he did know more hexes and jinxes, he *could* 
have learned them from books and his own creativity, and practiced 
them as well.  After all, as long as his mother was living there, 
too, wouldn't any Ministry of Magic detection of magic have been 
assumed to be *her* actions, not Severus'?  I think I recall this 
being explained somewhere in either one of the last two books or by 
JKR in an interview.

wynnleaf