What Came First: Task or Cabinet? - The Plan v1 & v2

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 157668

> > >>Alla:
> > Why? I am sorry again, but why does Draco need to tell it to 
> > Dumbledore?
> > <snip>
> 
> Betsy Hp:
> I can't believe I'm going to say this to you, Alla, but here goes: 
> Because the hero of the story is not Draco, it's Harry.  Why would 
> JKR carry over a mystery involving Draco that she'll have to deal 
> with in Book 7 and take time away from the story of Harry?  
Draco's 
> mystery in HBP (what is he up to?) was a one book mystery because 
> Draco is not the hero.  If Draco approached Voldemort with a plan 
> then he'd have mentioned it to Dumbledore during the great summing 
> up when we learned that Draco *did* nearly kill Katie and Ron. 

Alla:

Heee, well, it is a good enough reason if one considers Draco going 
to Voldemort first to be a mystery not as a part of backstory which 
not have needed to be revealed.
So, I am afraid I cannot accept as a given that Draco would have 
mentioned it to Dumbledore, although shhhhh, I think he probably 
would have. What again I am arguing against? :-)

 
> Betsy Hp:
> But this theory isn't a backstory.  It goes right to the heart of 
> the Draco mystery.  What is he doing and why?
<SNIP>

Alla:

See above, I see the argument that it does not necessarily go to the 
heart of Draco's mystery, because after the initial point, Steve and 
Magpie's version is really collide IMO.



 > Betsy Hp:
> Basically you're asking us to put equal weight to the "cabinet 
came 
> first" theory (not mentioned or thought of by *any* character in 
> canon) as to what we're told in the books by a character in the 
> books.  So you're asking for pure speculation (readers) to match 
> actual canon (Narcissa speaking as JKR directs her to). 
> 
> I mean, sure Narcissa might be wrong about Voldemort's motivation 
> (though I would ask, why?), but she's *very* clear that Voldemort 
> chose Draco.  No mention is made of Draco going to Voldemort, 
which 
> is what the "cabinet came first" theory demands.

Alla:

No, not at all. I would not dream of matching canon facts with 
speculation. I mean I think it is a fair game to respond to canon 
argument with speculation because after book 7 any speculation can 
become correct IMO, but I would always acknowledge that speculation 
as of this moment is a weaker argument.

I see Narcissa asking Snape to confirm Voldemort motivations and not 
really see him doing that. I see chapter name as "Spinner End", I 
see three people in the room , who really do not trust each other 
IMO. All of that makes me question the reliability of this canon, or 
more like totally see the reasonableness of the questioning of how 
realiable this canon is.

I do not **deny** that Steve's theory is speculation, although if 
you ask me it is a very very canon built on speculation, because to 
me from Draco learning about cabinet, Draco wanting revenge and 
Draco **not** acting as being forced to do something and being 
thrilled to be in Voldemort's service is a very small leap to make 
to Draco approaching Voldemort himself. Draco remarks that Greyback 
is friend of the family, Bella has direct access to Voldemort,etc.

I see no problem of Draco getting to Voldemort if he wishes so, 
**but** it is of course speculation. The only thing is to me it is 
speculation vs potentially unreliable canon or in some places canon 
interpretation.

 
I think the main reason I am writing this post since I felt I have 
said enough on the subject is the argument that I SO do not buy from 
Steve's is the idea that this plan of Voldemort could not have 
happened ( punishing Lucius through Draco) is because it is 
irrational.

Um, here I can echo Magpie's words. We are talking about Voldemort, 
who waited whole year to kidnap Harry and who. did. not. kill. him . 
when. he. had. the child. tied up. Nooooo, he had to duel with the 
boy to show that he is erm... better wizard. We are talking about 
**that** Voldemort.

Sorry, Steve, I don't think that rationality is Voldemort strong 
suit at all.

He hits below the belt, he hits on people's love towards their 
families, he tries to steer discourse between friends (Marauders 
suspecting each other anyone?)

Nah, that is probably the main reason I am so buying Voldemort 
punishing Lucius without any other **rational** purpose in mind, 
because that is what evil overlords do IMO, even though I can 
totally see "cabinet came first" :)

JMO,

Alla.