Grey!Snape and Character Growth (was:Voldemort's Plan for Snape & the Ring..

[Jen Reese]

No: HPFGUIDX 162842

> Carol responds:
> I don't think I've made this particular argument (I can never have
> too much of Snape), but I do think that the key point is not a
> change of heart in Snape but the revelation of his loyalties, which
> will come as a shock to Harry. 

Jen: I apologize for not answering fully earlier, but I was struck by 
what seemed to be implications about DDM that didn't click with what 
I've been reading.  As for the loyalty issue, I answered this a bit 
in a post to Betsy and won't go into detail but I see it as secondary 
to the lesson Harry will learn below.

Carol:
...and it is Harry who has to learn Dumbledore's lessons (mercy, 
forgiveness, trust in Snape). Snape is Snape, and he's not going to 
change, either in essential character or in loyalty, IMO. We, and 
Harry, will simply find out that he is and remains DDM (or whatever).

Jen: Yes, complete agreement.  Although I feel like you are saying in 
most of your other arguments that there is nothing to forgive Snape 
*for*, which will completely ruin this part of the story.  If Harry  
is to learn about mercy and trusting Snape, see him through the eyes 
of compassion, there must be things Harry needs to feel merciful and 
forgiving about.

Carol: There's no room in the story for Snape's own internal 
conflict, which has long since been suppressed or overcome. 

Jen: I see his loyalty as static, but his person is not. Once again 
he made a mistake with the UV that contributed to an innocent 
person's death and this time by his own hand.  Snape salvaged a 
situation that he himself had a part in setting up.  Maybe Snape 
expects Harry to 'thank him on bended knee' for saving his life just 
like he expected James to, when he himself made a contribution to 
both needing saving in the first place?  

Carol:
> And all the time, throughout the book, there's the parallel motif of
> the Half-blood Prince, who improves Potions and invents clever 
> spells and reminds Harry of Snape's lesson on Bezoars, an unknown
> teenage boy whom Harry sees as a friend, who helps him out in many
> ways--and turns out to be Snape. But at the end of the book, all
> Harry sees is Snape as murderer of Dumbledore.

Jen: I believe Harry identifies with that boy and that will be 
important for his own compassion, but it says more about who Snape 
was & what he lost, imo. 

Carol:
> Sad to say, Snape has had his book. We'll find out more about him,
> of course. We'll have to for the reveal/reversal to make sense. But
> most of it will be snippets of Snape's past and none of it will be 
> insight into the inner workings of Snape's mind. 

Jen:  I don't expect delving into the inner workings of Snape's mind 
to reveal some information about him.  POA and GOF both delved into 
stories about the central figure whom Harry was going to have a 
revelation about and they were quite satisfying in detail and scope 
without being a therapy session.  I don't understand this part?  I 
believe JKR has proven her ability to focus on contradictions and 
still reveal a person for who he/she is.  

> Carol:
> I agree that he detests having to go back to Voldemort, but that was
> always part of the plan from at least GoF and possibly before, as, I
> think, was giving Snape the cursed DADA position when he was most
> needed, a year of passing on his skills and knowledge to the 
> students before the DADA curse forced his return to Voldemort and,
> as you so beautifully put it, " a confluence of events forced Snape
> out in the open (ironically on the wrong side)." But, IMO, what
> Snape is now saddled with is not attachment to any person or group
> (though Draco could prove to be a thorn in his side) but the agony
> of intensified remorse. If he felt remorse for his part in the 
> Potters' being targeted and killed by Voldemort, what must he feel
> now at having been forced, not by the UV alone but by 
> the "confluence of events," to kill Dumbledore? And now, having 
> lost everything, he must pretend to be loyal to Voldemort. 

Jen: I see Snape as part of the confluence of events, though!  I 
didn't mean he was outside that and life was happening to him, he 
took part in the UV, he wanted the DADA job (presumably).  And Snape 
is weighted down with obligations he doesn't want, imo.  Returning to 
Voldemort, carrying through with Dumbledore's plans for Harry and 
having 'custody' of Draco for all intents and purposes since Narcissa 
has no influence over Voldemort.  It's one thing to be a double-agent 
and appear to play both sides, it's quite another to be forced out of 
that role and *have* to go to the enemy camp.  It's the worst 
possible scenario for a double-agent.  

Carol:
> But you don't need to hold your breath for Snape to show mercy. He
> has already done so. Look again at the healing scene in the
> Sectumsempra chapter. Snape is forgiving Draco for fighting the
> Chosen One and trying to kill Dumbledore, and he is letting him 
> continue his assignment, very much against Snape's will, IMO,
> because Dumbledore believes in choices and second chances. 

Jen:  You mean Snape would have rather let Draco die and he himself 
then die from the UV there than carry out Dumbledore's plan but 
instead did as Dumbledore would have wanted?  I'm not seeing another 
option if he didn't save Draco.  Not to belittle that he created a 
healing means for the Sectumsempra, but once again that was his own 
curse; The healing would not be necessary if he hadn't invented the 
curse.  Sort of like the Potters wouldn't have needed to be saved 
without Voldemort knowing the prophecy and Harry and Draco wouldn't 
need to be saved on the tower if Snape hadn't played a role in that 
scenario (not placing the full burden on Snape there, just saying he 
played a role in all these situations and seems to be continually 
making mistakes he then has to play a role in correcting).

Carol:
> An In "The flight of the Prince," he has *Harry* at his mercy. He
> knows what spell Harry'ss going to cast, but he simply deflects the 
> spells rather than fighting him. He saves him from a Crucio. And he
> stands over him when Harry is wandless and helpless, taunting him
> with "Kill me like you killed him, you coward!" and his only
> response is an anguished "Don't--call me coward." 

Jen: I'm not seeing mercy here though I once did, Dumbledore bought 
Harry's and Draco's life with his sacrifice.  Snape's entrusted with 
them now and if Dumbledore means anything to Snape and he does 
obviously as both of us see his deep pain and remorse, then Snape 
will not defile his death by hurting Harry or undermining the very 
plan he just sacrificed a life for.

> Carol, noting that neither Snape nor Draco is Harry's nemesis (that
> role is reserved for Voldemort)

Jen: I believe Draco is Harry's nemesis from his own generation, his 
schoolboy nemesis.  Dumbledore tried to ensure Harry was more than 
the Chosen One, he wanted him to have as normal a life as possible 
and that was part of the reason to stall on telling the prophecy.