Snape getting off scott freeWAS: Re: Harry Forgiving Snape

[dungrollin]

No: HPFGUIDX 162902

> > Dungrollin:
> > It's not because I think the punishment would do him any good, 
> > neither is it because I think he would deserve it, but because 
if you let Snape off this time, who knows who might be let off by 
mistake next time? If you do it for a good reason this time, you 
> > open the door to doing it for a bad reason next time; it 
> compromises the process of justice.
> <SNIP>
> 
> Alla:
> 
> Well,yes, if we are making RL comparison, I can see the rationale. 
> Orders or no orders, one should take at least take some 
> responsibility for the killing.
> 
> It is just if we are talking about punishment in story like this, 
it seems to me that the **technical** guilt would not be 
> punished,contrary to RL, that JKR would only want to punish Snape 
if he is truly guilty in his heart of hearts, hehehhe ( see another 
> thread).
> 
> Does that make sense? I suppose that we are again facing the 
question whether unforgivable itself is worthy of punishment. (RE: 
never ending question what is dark magic).
> 

Dung:
Weeelll... I think we should separate the two questions, to be 
honest; on the one hand punishing Snape because he used an 
unforgivable, and on the other hand, punishing him for murder. I 
don't particularly want to go into the first one, but just to say 
that if the law in the WW is that you get a life sentence for every 
Unforgivable cast, yes Snape should be punished for it; though 
again, mitigating circumstances should be taken into account: having 
made the decision to kill DD as DD had asked, was there any way that 
Snape could have fullfilled the purposes of killing DD without using 
an unforgivable, and would, say, letting him bleed to death (or any 
other alternatives) have been morally better? 


Alla:
> But if Snape acted with the best intentions, followed DD orders, 
etc, in Potterverse what should he be punished for?
> 
> I mean, again no punishment is big enough for him in mind, but our 
> versions of Snape are differing a lot :), so if we are strictly 
> looking at him as fiction without comparison with RW justice 
system, what should Heroic Snape and martyr for the cause be 
punished for?
> 

Dungrollin:
I think we kind of agree, actually. I'm most definitely *not* saying 
that killing DD was moral or good per se, but (assuming DDM!Snape 
caveat caveat etc etc) I think it was a better action than the 
alternative (which, obviously, I believe is Snape chickening out and 
dying from the vow, resulting in DD, Draco and possibly Harry all 
dead). 

>From my point of view, neither choice was morally brilliant, so no I 
don't think he *deserves* to be punished, because I don't think he 
had a good alternative, but I do think he ought to be. Which is 
horribly unfair (if you're fond of Snape), but in my little dream-
world Snape's accepted that he'll be punished for it, and I imagine 
he would hand himself in once Voldemort's safely dead. I can even 
fantasise that Harry tries to persuade Snape to go into hiding like 
Sirius for the rest of his life, but I can't imagine Snape doing 
that, somehow. 

Alla:
> I mean, in his heart of hearts he was only following DD orders and 
I suppose he really resisted that, it is all Dumbledore fault. :)
> It should all be magic that way and he should get his reward.

Dung:
I can see what you mean, but if Snape were to be forgiven and let 
off the hook, I would definitely end the books with a sour taste in 
my mouth. I think I would think (it's difficult to predict my 
reactions to hypotheticals!) that the increasing maturity and 
complexity of the books had been betrayed for a sugary-sweet fairy-
tale ending. I wouldn't find Snape being widely hailed as a hero and 
being pardoned by the Minister convincing, because he's just not 
hero material. Heros have to be at least superficially likeable, 
which Snape sooo isn't. 

On the other hand... if it is Snape himself who casts the Avada 
Kedavra which kills Voldemort (while harry's possessing him, or 
something) then I might find a pardon believable (though I doubt I'd 
think it was *right*). And yes, I might find it believable that he 
was hailed as a hero, simply because the WW is wierd about powerful 
witches and wizards, and if Snape had killed both DD and Voldy, the 
two most powerful wizards in, well, at least Wizarding Britain, he'd 
probably be hailed as a great and powerful wizard, if not 
necessarily a particularly nice one. 

I wouldn't want a sugary-sweet ending for Snape, though (as I've 
said before) I really really really don't want him to die. You 
shouldn't have to pay for your second chance by dying. Not that I'm 
saying that's the 'message' JKR would be sending if she wrote it 
that way, after all if Draco and/or Pettigrew 'turn', they might 
make it through alive - I just don't want it to be Snape who has to 
pay with his life. 

Nah, give him two years in Azkaban, out in eighteen months. I'd find 
that appropriate, both character and story-wise, and appropriate 
from the point of view of WW justice.

Dungrollin