Harry and Draco's views of each other WAS: Re: Real child abuse

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 145853

> Magpie:
> 
> Harry sees himself the way Harry sees himself.  Snape and Draco 
see 
> themselves the way they see themselves.  They all are pretty sure 
of their 
> views of the other.  I think all their viewpoints are skewed.  I 
live in 
> Harry's head in the text too, but I don't always agree with the 
way he sees 
> things--including Draco.  I don't think Harry always has a view of 
others 
> (including Draco) that is any more accurate than Draco's view of 
Harry.  I 
> don't think either boy's view of himself is always accurate either.

Alla:

Harry is always accurate? Of course not, but yes, I do think that 
Harry's view of Draco is a great deal more accurate than Draco's 
view of Harry. And I think HBP confirmed it splendidly. IMO of 
course. Harry knew that Draco is up to something and Draco was up to 
very dangerous something. Harry did not know of course that Draco in 
the middle of cooking up assassination of the Headmaster realized 
that he is not up to the task.


Magpie:
> Life would be great if we were always right and humble and did 
nothing to 
> earn dislike while the person we hate is exactly the way we 
imagine him to 
> be and deserving of all the hatred that I have so objectively feel 
for him. 
> I just don't think it's true.

Alla:

Agree as general philosophical proposition. Disagree on specific 
application of that general proposition. Harry got Draco's down 
as "pureblood bigot", Draco IMO is a pureblood bigot. What is wrong 
with Harry's view of Draco here? IMO nothing. Sure, Harry does not 
concern himself with the questions why Draco is a bigot, but why 
should he?

Magpie:
> In this case, the facts actually do show Harry getting special 
treatment. 

Alla:

I remember Harry getting special treatment ONCE during six books, 
namely receiving a broom stick and getting on the Quidditch team in 
his first year, which I cannot even wholeheartedly call special 
treatment, because IMO he got on the team because of his talent, not 
because of special connections or something.
While Draco gets on the team during his second year as everybody 
should, BUT because his father bought broomsticks for the whole team.

I think Draco is getting far more preferential treatment, because we 
are given no clues IMO that he getting on the team has anything to 
do with him being the best seeker, but in any event, I am ready to 
concede that Harry got special treatment once. Do you have any other 
examples of Harry getting special treatment?


Magpie:
<SNIP>
 This just makes it seem even more important that these idiots 
> get some perspective on each other and on themselves.


Alla:

I think that by the end of HBP Harry is already giving a lot more 
perspective to Draco than he deserves. Harry feels pity for him and 
I applaud Harry for that - to feel pity for someone who is directly 
involved in the murder of his mentor, even if he did not directly 
cast Avada is remarkable IMO indeed.

BUT I am still to see Draco feel ANY positive thought towards Harry.

I can totally see Draco surviving the war, somehow escaping 
Voldemort and turning into new Snape - same hateful character, 
dislike of Muggleborns ( that is just speculation of course - I 
don't know if Snape dislikes Muggleborns now) and maybe same hatred 
of Potter if Harry saves his life.

So, no, I don't see that Harry and Draco views of each other are 
even closely comparable. I mean I can totally see Harry not looking 
for hidden depths of Draco's character ( and I would have found it 
weird if Harry DID start looking for hidden depths in Draco) and 
vice versa, but I don't see Harry's view of Draco's "public persona" 
as being skewed. IMO of course. I think Harry judged well what he 
saw of Draco, while Draco's judgment of any part of Harry's 
character is IMO totally skewed.

Having said all that, I can see JKR to make Draco have a revelation 
AND escape of the trap which Snape put himself in - namely I can see 
Draco thanking Harry for saving his life and not hating him for it 
or something like that, but that would be my most optimistic 
scenario for Draco.

Hmmm, maybe Draco will be able to see who Harry really is in book 7 
and save Harry's life THAT IMO would be even more optimistic 
scenario, since I see no signs yet that Draco changed his character 
disposition. All that I see is that he was unable to finish the 
murder when he was face to face to his victim, while having no 
problem trying to kill two students while not being face to face to 
them.


JMO of course,

Alla