Real child abuse/ESE!lupin questions

[pippin_999]

No: HPFGUIDX 145886

 
> > Pippin:
> > > The existence of an unidentified Death Eater who "sent" the
> > > Lestranges to attack the Longbottoms per JKR's website.
> > > Bella would not take orders from Snape or Peter. JKR says all 
> > > the major characters have been introduced. So who was it?
> > 
> > Alla:
> > 
> > Oh, I am sure that we will know the person. My money is on Snape of 
> > course. My question will be how do you know that Bella won't take 
> > Orders from Snape? Do you have any indication of Bella and Snape 
> > relationship during those years? It seems to me that even now, Bella 
> > completely bought Snape as trusted second in command and we SEE that 
> > all DE treat Snape on the Tower with great deference. 

Gerry:
 Did I miss something? I would really appreciate if someone could point
> me to the canon that indicates the four were -sent- to the
> Longbottoms. Bella's speach indicates no one else. It could easily be
> Crouch sr. who said something which Crouch jr. interpreted in this
> way. Far more logical than either Snape or Lupin, who had no
> connections to the Aurors at all.

Pippin:
It's from the rumours section of the JKR website
http://www.jkrowling.com/textonly/en/rumours_view.cfm?id=25

The Lestranges were sent after Neville to kill him

No, they weren't, they were very definitely sent after Neville's parents. 
I can't say too much about this because it touches too closely on 
the prophecy and how many people knew about it, but the Lestranges 
were not in on the secret.
----
Bella certainly doesn't trust Snape at their meeting in Spinner's End.
It's clear she hasn't had a chance to question him since LV lost power, 
so how could she have been taking orders from him in the interim?
Why would she accuse him of doing nothing to find LV if he'd been
involved in the plot against the Longbottoms? If she'd been closely
associated with Snape prior to Azkaban  wouldn't she have
blabbed enough  to let  Sirius know  Snape was a DE?

Amiable Dorsai:
And what a powerfully useful addition to Voldemort's ranks Remus must
be! Imagine having the cool nerve, the incredible aim, and the split
second timing needed to hex Sirius from a distance--with a spell that
leaves a visible trail between the caster and the target--in front of
Harry, Neville, Dumbledore and Kingsley, (I think that completes the
list of good guys, saving Sirius himself, who were conscious at the
time) and not have any of them notice! Wandlessly!


Pippin:
I think you will find that Dumbledore was looking away, Kingsley
was behind the dais, and Harry and Neville were behind Lupin.
So the only good guy in a position to observe the visible trail
between the caster and its target was Sirius -- and he did look
surprised. Still you have a point -- it was too daring and desperate
an act for a casual killing, plus we have JKR's assurance that Sirius
died for a reason. But here we must leave the solid footing of
unassailable canon and pursue that flighty temptress speculation.

Most likely, Sirius died because he knew too much. But what?

Sirius calls out to Harry to take the prophecy and run. If he saw
it in Harry's hand, what need to tell him to take it? But if not, how
would he think that Harry knew what he was talking about? Snape
and Dumbledore know that Harry hasn't a clue what the prophecy
is or how to recognize it. The Death Eaters don't know that. 
According to Lucius, they assumed that Dumbledore would have
told Harry all about it. So who could have conveyed that assumption
to Sirius? Only a Death Eater -- and not Snape. 

Alla:

Right, OK the majority of the reasons you brought up I think are
simply plot related reasons or I have some very fundamental meta
disagreements with them, so I won't even talk about them, but I wish
you would clarify some of them.

Such as this one - Lupin also suspected that Sirius was a spy,
right? Do you categorize Sirius as one of DE also?

Pippin:
I don't see the relevance. If Lupin was mistaken about Sirius, does
that somehow imply that Sirius was mistaken about Lupin? 


Pippin:
> his identification of the werewolves as his "equals"

Alla:

And they are not? No, seriously how does this point out to Lupin's
hidden allegiance?

Pippin:
> his grievance against Umbridge

Alla:

Same question here.

Pippin:
Lupin has always been susceptible to pressure from his peer 
group. He now sees the werewolves as his peers, his fellows and
equals, and they have a common enemy in Umbridge. The
werewolves are mostly on Voldemort's side. So there would
be pressure on Lupin to go along, and if his conscience complained
about it, he has a long history of not listening.

Pippin:
> the intractable nature of the werewolf problem

Alla:

Sorry, don't have my dictionary handy. Is intractable a synonym to
incurable? If yes, do you mean that Lupin went to Voldemort hoping
that Voldemort will cure him or do you mean something different?

Pippin:
"Intractable" means "difficult to manage or govern." When used of
conflicts, it means they can't be readily resolved by negotiation or 
mediation.  Neither side feels it can offer a compromise the other
side would accept. The wizards won't compromise on their childrens'
safety, the werewolves won't compromise with the wizards who've
deprived them of their rights. The temptation is to resort to force,
and Voldemort is far more amenable to the use of force than
Dumbledore.

Pippin