The GoF Train Scene - and beyond (was:Re: Humanity, Kant, Caricatures, and Draco

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 146789

Magpie:
<SNIP>

> So with Draco I think the point Betsy is making is not that Draco 
> was best buddies with Cedric and Krum and secretly cried into his 
> pillow over Cedric's death.  She's just saying that we shouldn't 
> assume he didn't have to repress any feelings of fear or confusion 
> over Cedric ending up dead and that this could play into the train 
> scene.  I think he is able to repress them and postpone any real 
> awakening in GoF. In OotP he has to deal with some different issues 
> connected to his father's involvement with the DEs.  It's in HBP, 
> imo, where he's really cracking.  But I do think at the end of the 
> series I would not be surprised if we are able to see a shape to his 
> story that includes things like Cedric's death.

Alla:

Actually, I can buy your variation of this argument, BUT the only 
reason I can buy it that in light of HBP it is just as reasonable 
possibility as any others for Draco. 

Possibility that Draco was afraid because of Cedric died? Sure, why 
not? It is possible. I don't find it to be very likely, but I agree 
that it is possible. What I am not getting is how Draco's possible 
feelings of fear over Cedric's death trasform into his need to go to 
gryffs appartment and start mocking Cedric's death.

> Betsy Hp:
> And I do think Draco did some serious squelching.  I think any hint 
> of conscious doubt would have been met with some major brick walls.  
> And I think Draco marching into the Gryffindor compartment and 
> spitting his defiance right into the lion's eye, as it were, was his 
> best attempt at regaining his balance.  (Though I do think some 
> hairline fractures probably remained, or at least, there were some 
> new weak spots in Draco's belief system.)

Alla:

You make it sound as if Draco committed some heroic action, which 
makes me very confused. Magpie's "Draco having some fear over Cedric's 
death" I can buy as I said above.  Defiance implies defying of someone 
who started bothering Draco first, IMO anyway. Maybe it is again 
semantics. Does defiance has another definition except "willingness to 
resist"? Who was bothering Draco first? Besides, he did not even come 
ALONE. I would have probably bought into his confusion more if he did. 
But, no, with all his emotional shake-up, he did not forget to take 
his goons with him. I wonder whether he expected to find Harry alone 
and start throwing hexes at him? Draco came into appartment to start a 
fight with  the boy who was tortured and just witnessed a death of the 
classmate  and to mock the death of that classmate. Where you find 
defiance, I am not sure. I think issuing any kind of challenges to 
Draco was the last thing on Harry's mind before Draco showed up and 
started provoking him.


JMO,

Alla