The Too Unreliable Narrator (was: What really happened on the tower)

[Mike]

No: HPFGUIDX 155882

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Neri" <nkafkafi at ...> wrote:
> Neri:
> I use "unfair" here according to my very personal definition, as
> shorthand for "a non-description that is used to fool the hero and 
> the reader".
<snip> 

> I defined "non-description" as something that the hero must know or
> see, and yet the narrator doesn't describe.

> Still in that same first post I invented the term "unfair 
> non-description" for a non-description that the narrator uses to 
> fool *both* the hero and the reader, and pointed out that JKR     
> seems to avoid them.
<snip>

> Yet until now she has never has never fooled *both* the reader 
> and Harry using a non-description. This suggests to me that she 
> also considers it unfair.
<BIG snip> 

Mike now:

I lined up these parts of your post to try and drill it (using a 
Dursley drill bit) into my head. I think I've got it, let's see if I 
do. For the "unfair" to kick in, it's not only we the reader who 
must be tricked, but Harry must be "fooled" also, when she utilizes 
a "non-description". Is that right, Neri?

> Neri:
> If we assume JKR fools us (as in an ESE!Lupin scenario) then Harry 
> *doesn't* know who cursed Sirius. He believes with us that it was 
> Bella, but it was actually ESE!Lupin, and Harry would be extremely
> surprised to learn it.
<snip>

> By definition, we and Harry can't be treated to a non-description. 
> My definition of a non-description is something that Harry does 
> see but we don't.

Mike again:

This is where I'm still hazy. How can Harry be fooled if the 
definition includes him knowing? IOW, is it "unfair" if later on 
Harry walks up to Lupin and says, 'I know it was you who cursed 
Sirius', or only if Lupin surprises Harry by admitting, 'I was the 
one who got Sirius'?

If it's the first case, we weren't *both* fooled. But if is the 
second case, then Harry doesn't know. How could we possibly *get* 
an "unfair non-description"? How can we *both* be fooled and have 
the hero *know* the non-description at the same time? I'm beginning 
to see why nobody has given you a valid example, by definition you 
can't have one. <g>

<snip> 
> Neri:
> It's quite possible that JKR is either cheating here or has made 
> some mistake. It won't be the first time (she already corrected   
> the priori incantatum order) and she admitted that GoF was rushed 
> to print. But this still remains to be seen, and in any case, even 
> if she cheated here it wasn't by using a non-description the way I 
> defined it.

Mike finishing off:

I submit that it was a non-description. IMO, something must have 
come out of LV's wand, representing the AK thrown at Harry, between 
Bertha and Lily. Further, I submit that Harry would have seen/heard  
it, but it wasn't described to us the reader. Cheating or mistake, I 
still think this qualifies as a non-description.