[HPforGrownups] Re: Whose side are we on??

[Magpie]

No: HPFGUIDX 156117

> Alla:
> And I am really not sure how Dudley example works here, because if
> Dudley's behaviour would be exception of his otherwise good
> intentions, sure, that's what I call it. The problem is - I don't
> see Dudley showing **any** good intentions, whatsoever, to me he
> exhibits only **bad** behavior, period. I have nothing to sympathise
> with Dudley, zero. That is of course plays a role in me not having
> any sympathy for him in Toffey accident, pig accident or anything
> else.

Magpie:
I don't think we have to feel sympathy for him, exactly.  I mean, beyond the 
basic empathy of another person feeling something negative.  But one should 
be able--as I think you've done in the thread--to say, "I don't like Dudley. 
The fact that he's been such a bully to Harry and others makes it satisfying 
to me to see him have this prank played on him.  Still, what the Twins are 
doing there isn't right and they need to be more responsible with their 
power..." or something like that, whatever you think.  The toffee prank 
isn't particularly funny to me, but that's my taste.  There are things in 
the books that I do find funny, even if they're also cruel.  For example:

Alla:
> And what do we see of Draco? Making fun of Hagrid status in school,
> person whom he **never** met before. I found it quite disgusting,
> personally.

Magpie:
I thought that was a funny scene and didn't find it disgusting.  He was 
sharing gossip about a servant at the school as it was reported to him--and 
the truth in it made it painful.  It was also even worse because Harry 
happened to consider Hagrid his only friend in the world.  There's nothing 
particularly good in what Draco says there, but I find it funny.  It's not 
OOC for him to be speaking that way, but it doesn't make me lose sympathy 
for him--that's probably the moment I started liking him as a character. 
For some people it does.  Either way it's still something Draco's done 
that's part of his characterization.

> Alla:
>
> Well, there is certainly a question of the degree. I don't want bad
> guys to be caricatures, but I sure prefer them to **not** get away
> from their punishment. There are books in which it is inevitable and
> maybe people want to see it in Potterverse too. I don't.

Magpie:
I don't think they will get away from their punishment--I think JKR will 
love punishing them.  But hopefully it will be more rehabilitating than just 
continuing vengeance--I'm speaking about the younger characters there, as I 
don't think rehabilitating the baddie adults (or the Dursleys) is in the 
cards. But I think the good guys will also have to go through some learning 
experiences where they question their own behavior, maybe just because that 
seems to obviously be the most dramatic thing.  Often fandom's ideas for 
what should happen completely sheild Harry et al. from that sort of thing, 
but I feel like JKR would instinctively go more for the jugular there, and 
try to heal the split.

-m