[HPforGrownups] Re: Harry's arrogance (was Evil Snape)

[Magpie]

No: HPFGUIDX 154406

>>Marion:
>> <snip> I've heard fans call Draco a 'bully' (because he walks around
> with two thugs: that's classic bully alright), but we've never heard
> of Crabbe or Goyle really beating up people. <snip>
>
> Carol responds:
> As I recall, Neville fights with Crabbe and Goyle twice, once in SS/PS
> during a Quidditch match (I can't remember who attacked whom) and once
> when Neville attacks Draco for his snide remarks about people being
> confined to St. Mungo's for permanent mental injuries. Their purpose
> seems to be to protect Draco. Apparently they don't act on their own.
> (It's interesting that Crabbe briefly stands up to Draco in HBP. Is he
> less stupid than we think?)

Magpie:
For accuracy, I think it's that Draco is teasing Ron, and Ron jumps Draco. 
The two of them fight and Neville jumps into help Ron, where upon Crabbe and 
Goyle jump Neville.  I think that's how it's described.

It's funny the thing about Crabbe standing up to Draco--to me it reads like 
concern.  I think Crabbe (who's sometimes called the smarter one) is also 
the one who picks up ferret!Draco.  Given how things must have looked from 
his angle, I can see him seeing the Draco is in trouble and getting deeper 
into trouble, and being concerned for him (and for himself as well).  Draco 
hasn't told him even what's going on, he's physically deteriorating, 
stressing out--I'd be freaked out.  I thought it was one of those things 
hinting that Harry ought to consider the ties on the Slytherin side, which 
he has always dismissed as not being important.

Also poor Crabbe trying desperately to get a line in canon and Draco cuts 
him off with "I know what you're going to say."  I'm sure JKR was laughing 
when she wrote that.

> Carol responds:
> When does Harry refer to himself in capital letters? It's the Daily
> Prophet that calls him the Boy Who Lived and the Chosen One and
> whatever else.

Magpie:
He does, I think, call himself the Chosen One to Slughorn when he's trying 
to get the memory, but of course he's doing that to manipulate him.  Does he 
refer to himself as a Marked Man?

Eggplant:
If instead of Draco holding his wand on a ill Dumbledore Harry had
held his wand on a ill Voldemort I think Voldemort would be toast.
Harry's nerve failed him only once, when he stopped Sirius and Lupin
from dealing with Peter Pettigrew. Harry learns from his mistakes.

Magpie:
Well, yes, because Harry has good reason to kill Voldemort to protect 
himself and others.  Draco was committing an assassination of a good person 
under threat--that takes something more disturbing than just nerve.  He was 
conflicted as to what he wanted.  His whole story's about that, imo.  Harry 
had a more similar experience when he was going to kill Sirius Black--I 
wouldn't call that simply a loss of nerve, but something better.  He's going 
to do it, he says, but he's not doing it.  Thank goodness!  His nerve 
doesn't fail him at all when he stops Lupin and Black from killing 
Peter--how is his nerve failing him there?  He knows exactly what he thinks 
should be done and says it. Both Draco and Harry start out planning on just 
killing somebody thinking it's easy, but when the time comes it becomes 
something more real.

-m