Gone a while - question about Snape

[potioncat]

No: HPFGUIDX 154584


> Carol responds:
> I don't agree with the theory, either. (Sorry, Potioncat!) It makes
> Dumbledore too culpable, and besides, why would he offer himself as
> Secret Keeper if he *wanted* Voldemort to try to thwart the Prophecy
> by marking Baby!Harry as the Chosen One? And he told Harry that 
Snape
> was still a Death Eater reporting to his master at that point. I 
don't
> think he would lie to Harry about that, especially when he wants 
Harry
„h to trust Snape.

Potioncat:
DD says of the intruder, "being in LV's employ, he reported at once." 
So either DD knew Snape was a DE at that time, or he found out later. 
But even if DD didn't know Snape was a DE, it's odd he'd just let him 
go after hearing the Prophecy. He must know that Snape's friends are 
DEs. It looks to me as if DD knows he'll need to protect Trelawney; 
he expects LV to find out.  (I'm not suggesting DD ought to have 
Obliviated him--but one wonders why he didn't.)

The possibilities are:
1. DD lets Snape leave, knowing Snape heard part of the Prophecy. He 
doesn't know Snape is a DE, but he does know how important this 
information would be to LV, and he knows Snape has DE contacts. It's 
a risk--Snape could tell the "Funny thing that happened at the Hog's 
Head" story while sharing a few brews with the old gang. DD hires 
Trelawney and waits. 
 
2. DD knows Snape is a DE. Knows the information will get to LV, lets 
Snape go. DD hires Trelawney and waits.
 
3. After finishing Trelawney's interview, DD interviews Snape. Snape 
has come to talk to DD because Snape wants out of the DEs and knows 
DD will help him.  For whatever reason Snape joined in the first 
place, he's now sorry and he needs help. Perhaps Regulus is already 
dead. DD needs someone to spy for him, and he knows Snape is a sneak. 
(Yeah, well, I can hardly deny that, can I?) So Snape agrees to spy 
for DD. DD suggests Snape take this bit of information back to LV and 
to keep DD informed of LV's plans. DD hires Trelawney and waits.

I think the phrase "in his employ" implies that Snape was no longer a 
Death Eater at heart, but was obligated to continue serving.

>Carol: 
> Nor do I think that the Prophecy would have been made as early as
> September, as Potioncat suggests. I don't think even a Seer could
> predict the "approach" of "one" who hadn't been conceived yet. I 
think
> it would have been made on Halloween night (after the feast), which
> would be Harry's conception date if we consider a pregnancy as being
> exactly nine months long (as, of course, it wouldn't be in RL, but
„h this is the Potterverse). 
 
 Potioncat:
 I like Halloween as the date. I really, really do. However, if you 
look at what Trelawney says and when she says it, she had to have 
made the Prophecy before Halloween.  That is assuming that what she 
says is precise and JKR had done her math. (A lot to expect, I know.) 
She says to the class that 16 years of service has passed--then more 
time passes in the book before we are told it's November. So I'm 
betting Sep/early Oct.
 
 I considered the problem with the Prophecy happening before the 
conception. Then I thought about the most frequently debated parallel 
to HP---that story has a savior's birth being Prophesied long before 
the conception. (I don't want to start a new debate over that.)
 
 
 Carol:
  (BTW, I think that
 > Snape's reference in "Spinner's End" to sixteen years of 
information
 > on DD is a slip--he'd been working with and for DD for sixteen 
years,
 > but only fifteen as a Hogwarts teacher.) But even though he was 
loyal
 > to DD and regretted revealing the Prophecy to LV, the remorse 
didn't
 > fully kick in until after Godric's Hollow. I don't think he would 
have
 > felt that remorse if revealing the partial Prophecy to LV had been
„h part of a plan between DD and himself.

Potioncat:
It isn't a slip if LV sent Snape to spy on DD the night of the 
Prophecy. For example: LV wants someone at Hogwarts. Snape would be a 
good choice for DADA teacher, given his interest in the subject. He 
isn't openly a DE and his Half-Blood status would make him an 
unlikely member. So, on LV's orders, he goes to apply for the 
position. Trelawney thinks he's there for the job, so it's likely the 
DADA position hadn't yet been filled. DD turns him down, or he 
doesn't even get to apply, after the fiasco at the key hole, but he 
keeps applying and finally gets the job. This works whether or not 
Snape had "returned" yet. He could have been acting on LV's orders 
all along, and at some point used the chance to ask DD for help.  


Quotes are from memory--I know better--so I'm crossing my fingers and 
hoping I got it right.

Potioncat, who will be very sad if Snape dies and/or is evil; but 
thinks whatever JKR works out will still be a very satisfying ending.

This is the second attempt to post. Apologies if it comes up twice. 
Seems someone turned me into a ferret. I think I've found the counter-
curse.