[HPforGrownups] Re: High Noon for OFH!Snape

[P J]

No: HPFGUIDX 149471

Betsy Hp:
>Well, you sure could, but that's not what Snape entered the Vow for
>in the first place (as you acknowledge later) and there's still the
>billion dollar question:  Why would a man intent on protecting his
>own hide risk his life in such a massive way?

PJ:
Until the 3rd provision there was no risk!  He was promising to do exactly 
what he'd planned to do, what he *had* been doing, all along.

Betsy Hp:
>It does?  How?  Why would *out for HIMSELF*!Snape care about the
>Malfoys or his duty as head of house to such an extent he puts his
>*life* on the line?  Doesn't that directly oppose someone being out
>for *himself* rather than his friends or his duty?

PJ:
So what you're saying is that just because someone puts their own wants and 
needs first that this person is incapable of having *any* friends?  That's 
not very realistic, and JKR creates pretty realistic characters for her 
story.

Maybe I'm not understanding you but it looks like you're trying to make him 
a 2 dimensional character.  Either he's all good or he's all bad with no 
room in the middle for blatently self centered, and it can't work... He's 
much more complex than that imo...

Betsy Hp:
>I'm also confused as to how the Vow would prove his loyalty to Voldemort 
>more
>than booting the two women out of his house with a "The Dark Lord
>has spoken and so it must be."  He took the Vow *in spite* of
>Voldemort's wishes.  Not in obedience to them.

Read what I wrote again please.  I said it would help convince *Bellatrix* 
of his loyalty and get her off his back.  I give you this piece of canon to 
explain what I'm trying to say here.  "If you are there to protect him... 
Severus, will you swear it?  Will you make the Unbreakable Vow?"  "The 
Unbreakable Vow?" Snape's expression was blank, unreadable.  Bellatrix, 
however, lt out a cackle of triumphant laughter.  "Aren't you listening, 
Narcissa?  Oh, he'll *try*.  I'm sure... The usual empty words, the usual 
slithering out of action... oh on the Dark Lord's orders of course!" (HBP 
Spinner's End pg 35 US Version)

Without the UV Snape would not have been able to convince Bellatrix of his 
loyalty to LV and she would continue to talk about him, maybe convincing 
Voldemort that he should take another look at his spy Snape... He had no 
choice and what Cissy had *asked* him to take a vow for was no risk!  It was 
that dratted 3rd provision that she snuck in at the last minute which was 
the problem!

He didn't have to convince LV that he was loyal because if he wasn't  fairly 
well convinced of his loyalty, Snape would already be dead.  It was 
*Bellatrix* he really had to convince at that moment.

Betsy Hp:
>Exactly!  That's exactly why OFH!Snape doesn't work.  Because in
>Spinner's End Snape takes a calculated risk that he *knew* was going
>to *limit* his choices.

PJ:
Sorry but what Cissy *asked* him to vow *before* they began would not have 
limited his choices at all!  He's been "there to look after him, seeing he 
came to no harm and protecting him" without the vow since Draco started 
school...

Betsy Hp:
>Um... Why would OFH!Snape care about the Malfoys?

PJ:
Because they're friends.  It's canon.  "Severus... please... You are, you 
have always been, Draco's favorite teacher... *You are Lucius's old 
friend*... (HBP, Spinner's End pg33/34 US Edition)

Betsy Hp:
>The Vow that if it's broken you *die*?  That Vow?  Yeah, I think
>there was a huge possibility of skin being removed from noses here.

How?  If he's asked to take a vow to protect Draco and to watch over Draco, 
and he's been doing that very thing, and planning to continue doing that 
very thing with or without the vow, how is that dangerous to Snape?  Because 
that is what Cissy first asked him to take the vow *for*.


Betsy Hp:
>Snape was Vowing to help Draco while he tried to kill one of the
>main players in the little war Snape (according to OFH rules) was
>trying to avoid taking part in.  How could Snape *not* recognize
>that Draco was about to put his life in some serious danger.

PJ:
That is the 3rd provision, not what Cissy originally asked Snape to take a 
vow to do.

PJ