Perfect Lily (Re: But DID James listen?)

[Jen Reese]

No: HPFGUIDX 150070

Rebecca: 
> I agree with you both that JKR gives a glimpse into Lily's 
> character via the Pensieve scene in OoP and therein shows
> a "struggle" others might have to "do the right thing" in
> defending Snape from James and Sirius. (Note that Lupin who is
> sitting right there, doesn't lift a finger or say a word - tsk, 
> tsk, doesn't say much about his moral fiber there, now does it?)
> But like Harry, Lily does this intuitively because she knows it's
> the right thing to do - others would have had to think to make the
> decision, and in Harry and Lily's case, they don't have to - they
> take immediate action. 

Jen: Running with this a moment, I'm wondering about the things 
Harry struggles with rather than acting intuitively on. That might 
well be a clue to Lily's personality, unless his weak spots are all 
similar to James' struggles. And I'm not saying these 
characteristics can't be good in certain situations, just trying to 
list things we've actually heard might be a problem for Harry:

1) Following rules--James
2) Not acting impulsively or recklessly--James
3) Playing the hero--?? Maybe Lily could be like Hermione at times, 
saving people/creatures who don't ask to be saved or going about it 
in the wrong way. Snape could qualify in the Pensive scene, maybe 
even Petunia if Lily tried to change her into someone she wasn't.
4) Not taking schoolwork seriously enough--James sounds more likely, 
although both parents were good in school.

I can't think of others at the moment, someone else may be able to 
add to that list. Lily can be completely separate from Harry of 
course, just using Harry as a guideline since JKR has made a big 
deal of Harry being like both parents, and I hope all his negative 
qualitites aren't from James!

Rebecca:
> There are genuinely likable and good people in the world, and
> sometimes those people are very hard for the rest of society to
> accept without suspicion. As they say, she would be quite a catch.

Jen: Likeable and good vs. nearly flawless are different 
characterizations and not exactly what I'm trying to get at. All the 
major characters on the Good side have contributed in some way to 
the current situation through a mistake or misstep: Dumbledore, 
Peter, Snape (before switch and possibly after), Sirius/James, 
Lupin, even the Trio. Lily stands alone as having done the 
singularly right thing by her sacrifice.

Rebecca:
> We're dealing with an author who has had father troubles, so
> naturally one would suspect that her perception of fatherhood 
> could be impacted even in her writing. 

Jen: I'm not sure her motivation, she did say in the TIME article 
that she didn't realize most of her father figures were 'bad' until 
looking over the first five books in publication. So it was 
subconcious most likely.

Rebecca: 
> I mention again that ambition and cunning, such as Slytherin are
> noted for, are not necessarily *bad* characteristics to have as
> long as they are moderated with choices to live a full and happy
> life.The beauty of Lily's character is she appears to have done
> just that.

Jen: Just for the record, I wasn't saying Slytherin is bad or 
Slytherin charcteristics are negative. My list of 'cheeky, imperfect 
and doing well in Slytherin' are all things I'd *like* to see in 
Lily in Book 7. Aspects of true human behavior rather than her 
almost saint-like presence. If the twitch of her lips and her 
response to Snape calling her Mudlblood are all we're going to get, 
her role will primarily be the Sacrificial Mother.

I'm a proponent for Harry understanding why he would have made a 
good Slytherin in book 7. He proved himself able to be cunning in 
HBP and Dumbledore was behind him all the way, promoting Harry to 
use his ingenuity and cunning to retrieve the Slughorn memory. I'm 
all for the uniting of the Houses, or at least the beginning of that 
process, when the series ends.

Jen R.