CHAPDISC HBP 15, The Unbreakable Vow

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 152245

> >>Carol:
> CHAPTER DISCUSSION: Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince,       
> Chapter 15, The Unbreakable Vow.
> <snip summary>
> Discussion Questions:
> 1) What do you think of Ron's public "snogging" sessions with     
> Lavender...

Betsy Hp:
Very, very typical for highschool.  I think everyone had such a 
couple blocking lockers and treating every class apart as the pit of 
doom. <g>

> ... and Hermione's reaction? What about Ron's and Hermione's      
> behavior in Transfiguration?

Betsy Hp:
It was interesting to me that Ron is better at verbal cruelty than 
Hermione.  I think it goes towards him being more empathetic than 
she is.

> What does Harry (whose thoughts are paraphrased by the narrator)   
> mean by "the depths to which girls would sink to get revenge"?

Betsy Hp:
I think they both mean that girls can be scary.  Hell hath no fury, 
etc., etc.

> 2) Hermione says that love potions are not Dark or dangerous, but
> Harry, the intended recipient, disagrees. How "dark" is Romilda's 
> plot to get Harry to take her to Slughorn's party by, erm,        
> potioning him? And how responsible are the Twins, who made and     
> sold the love potions, for the uses to which the potions are put?

Betsy Hp:
I honestly have no idea how the WW breaks down what is "dark" magic 
and what is not.  I suspect it's arbitrary, like flying brooms being 
allowed but flying carpets a definite no-no.  Because love potions 
do strike me as dangerous, as we and Harry have seen.

But, since the WW does not outlaw love potions the twins are not 
breaking any laws buy selling them.  They are, however, breaking 
laws by smuggling them into Hogwarts.  Which means they're evil. 
<g>  No, I'm kidding.  It does show they play pretty fast and loose 
with rules though.  (I know, big surprise. <g>)

> 3) Harry expresses real interest in the Prince's notes on         
> Everlasting Elixirs and defends his book against both Hermione's   
> aspersions and Madam Pince's grasping hands. Is he just using the 
> Prince's notes to get marks he doesn't deserve, or is he really   
> learning more from the Prince than he ever learned from the adult 
> Snape or Slughorn? How might this new interest in Potions, if it   
> lasts, play out in Book 7?

Betsy Hp:
I agree with other posters that Harry doesn't really show a new 
interest in Potions, specifically.  He follows the Prince's 
instructions but doesn't seem interesed in the "how" or "why" of it 
all.  I also agree with houyhnhnm, that Harry shows more of an 
interest in how the Prince thinks as a person.  It points to a 
personal connection between Harry and Snape without their personal 
issues getting in the way.

> 4) We later learn that Madam Pince is not the only person listening
> behind the shelves: Draco is there as well. JKR is clearly         
> misleading the reader with a false or incomplete explanation. Can 
> you think of any other "explanations" that may be revealed as     
> misleading in the future?

Betsy Hp:
ESE! or OFH!Snape. <G>

> 5) Just for fun, why might Harry think that Filch and Pince are in
> love? Is Harry right?

Betsy Hp:
I think it points towards Harry being more aware generally of people 
coupling, because he's interested in it for himself now.  And based 
on Dumbledore's funeral, Harry may well be right.

> 6) Why do you think that Harry invited Luna to Slughorn's party?   
> What does his doing so tell us about him, compared to or          
> contrasted with Hermione's inviting Cormac McLaggen?

Betsy Hp:
Harry is more grownup than Hermione.  And more honest.

> Do you agree with Harry that Hermione got what she deserved when   
> Cormac ambushed her under the mistletoe? Why or why not?

Betsy Hp:
Hmm, I do hate the "she was asking for it" defense.  But Hermione 
lead McLaggen astray, so I'm going to say, yeah, she reaped what she 
sowed.  Especially since we don't see McLaggen actually *forcing* 
Hermione into anything.

> 7) What do you make of Luna's conversation with Trelawney? What
> insights into Luna does this chapter provide, or is she strictly   
> comic relief?

Betsy Hp:
I read it as comic relief, myself.  And I did laugh aloud a few 
times the first time through.

> And why would Slughorn invite Trelawney, of all people, along
> with his Slug Club, his celebrity guests, and his former star      
> pupil, Severus Snape?

Betsy Hp:
Because both Trelawney and Snape are Slugclub members.  Trelawney, 
like McLaggen and Blaise, is there because of her family (her 
grandmother Cassandra, the famous seerer).  Snape, like Hermione, is 
there because of his abilities.

> Just for fun, why do you think JKR included the Vampire Sanguini   
> as a party guest?

Betsy Hp:
Humor was a big part of it, I'm sure.  She plays rather well on the 
whole "sexy vampire" thing by having several girls interested in 
Sanguini, and him interested in them.  Also, since HBP deals a lot 
with lust, it was clever to throw in a vampire, creature of lust.

> 7) Why does Snape react as he does to Slughorn's statement that    
> Harry is a "natural" at Potions?

Betsy Hp:
Because he knows Harry *isn't* a natural at Potions.

> Are his suspicions aroused at this point?

Betsy Hp:
C'mon.  This is Snape!  And Harry is involved.  Of *course* his 
suspicions are aroused. <g>

> Do you detect any genuine affection on Slughorn's part for his
> brilliant former student, or is it all jovial bluster and too much
> mead? Did you feel any sympathy for Snape during this conversation?
> Why or why not?

Betsy Hp:
There must be some affection there or Snape wouldn't have attended 
the party.  Nor would he have suffered being snatched out of the 
crowd.  We learn at Spinner's End that Snape actually can handle 
social occasions well (contrary to much fanon) so I imagine he was 
even enjoying himself a little.

I didn't feel sorry for Snape at all.  I didn't get the sense that 
he was insulted by Slughorn's talking about Harry's sudden potion 
abilities.  Again, he's Snape.  Only the Marauders seem to be able 
to really get under Snape's skin.  And he's known Slughorn for a 
while now.  He must be used to Slughorn's ways.

> 8) Why does Draco claim to be "gate-crashing" when he was actually
> upstairs?

To avoid drawing attention to his activites and getting himself and 
his family killed.

> Why does he look angry when Slughorn allows him to stay?

Because he's not wanting to stay.  He's wanting to get to the Room 
of Requirement so he can work on the Cabinet.

> The narrator, voicing Harry's perspective, asks: "Why was Snape    
> looking at Malfoy as though both angry and . . . was it           
> possible? . . . a little afraid?" How would you answer the         
> narrator's (or Harry's) questions?

Betsy Hp:
Draco is up to something, and Snape doesn't know what it is.  That 
means Draco and the rest of the students are in danger.  As Snape is 
supposed to be acting as a barrier between Draco and the students 
and Draco and Voldemort, this lack of knowledge both angers and 
frightens Snape.  (Maybe more frightens which leads him to being 
angry.)

> 9) Draco's appearance suggests that he's suffering from stress or
> insomnia. Do you think that he was really too ill to play Quidditch
> (previous chapter)? 

Betsy Hp:
Draco may have been ill, but I think his main goal was getting free 
time with people out of the castle to work on the Cabinet.  I think 
Draco would have dragged himself to work on the Cabinet if blood was 
coming out his ears.  He's running out of time, and he knows it.

> How do you account for the change in his attitude toward his Head 
> of House and former favorite professor? What parallels, if any, do 
> you see between this relationship and Harry's with Dumbledore?

Betsy Hp:
To answer the first question, Draco is becoming disillusioned.  With 
Voldemort, with the Death Eaters, with everything his parents taught 
him.  Snape, as stand in father-figure, is catching the brunt of 
Draco's discontent.  Which answers the second question, I think.  
Harry went through the same disillusionment, to an extent, in OotP.  
Fortunately for Harry, he only had to realize that Dumbledore was 
human.  Not that he was also completely mistaken, which I think is a 
harder lesson to learn.

> 10) Clearly, Crabbe and Goyle are not taking NEWT DADA with Harry 
> and Draco. Might they be repeating fifth-year DADA (rather than    
> taking no DADA class at all), and could they, theoretically,       
> repeat their DADA OWLs as Snape implies?

Betsy Hp:
I imagine the slower students were the most effected by Umbridges' 
terrible teaching.  So I'd imagine there are more than just Crabbe 
and Goyle repeating fifth year DADA so they can take their OWLs 
again.  (Unless this is just something Snape insists on for his 
Slytherins.  Though I'm not sure Flitwick and Sprout would like 
their students to be so untrained.)

If Snape, a head of house, suggests that students can retake their 
OWLs, I see no reason to disbelieve him.  It's not like JKR has laid 
out exactly how things are done at Hogwarts.  We only get a very 
limited view.

> What, if anything, does this detail tell us about Snape's attitude 
> toward DADA? Is he really concerned about Crabbe's and Goyle's     
> DADA OWLs? What is he trying to accomplish by putting them in     
> detention?

Betsy Hp:
I'd say Snape sees DADA as important, that he does care for his 
students, but that he's killing more than one bird here.  If Draco 
doesn't have assistance hopefully he'll come to Snape for help.  
Unfortunately, Draco has lost a great deal of trust for Snape, it 
seems.

> 11) What do you make of Draco's contempt for DADA, his attempt at
> Occlumency, his reaction to Snape's Unbreakable Vow, and his
> accusation that Snape is trying to steal his glory?

Betsy Hp:
I hear Bellatrix in just about all of Draco's statements.  She's 
using Draco to gain her own glory, and Draco is too young and 
inexperienced to realize it.  And I think he's confused because 
everything he's been taught to believe is starting to come down 
around his ears.

> How successful are his attempts to evade Snape's questions? What, 
> if anything, does Snape learn from Draco's answers?

Betsy Hp:
He learns that Draco has been, and might still be, under Bellatrix's 
influence.  He learns that Draco has a specific plan that he's 
working on.  He learns that Draco has help from someone he considers 
a good source of help (Bellatrix?).  Snape actually learns quite a 
bit, despite Draco's successful occlumency.

> 12) Snape changes tactics several times during the interview. How 
> and why?

Betsy Hp:
I don't get the sense that Snape purposefully chose various tactics 
to get information out of Draco.  I think he's genuinely worried 
about Draco, and trying very hard to reach him.  But each question 
seemed to flow from Draco's responses.  To my mind, the conversation 
pointed to a close relationship between Draco and Snape.  That Draco 
was comfortable being that open with Snape, that Snape was able to 
continue the conversation for as long as he did without Draco 
shutting down, all suggest that they know each other pretty well.

> Are these changes an indication of weakness or strength?

Betsy Hp:
Frustration more than anything, IMO.  And fear for Draco.

> Do any of his statements or questions seem deliberately ambiguous 
> or misleading? How does this conversation tie in with, or affect   
> your understanding of, "Spinner's End"?

Betsy Hp:
It confirmed for me that Narcissa turned to the right man for help.  
I think Snape was being as honest as he could be in this situation.  
I think he really does want to help Draco.  Not to kill Dumbledore 
but to get him out of this trap Voldemort has put him in.

> 13) Snape's expression is twice referred to as "unfathomable" or
> "inscrutable." What does this description suggest to you?

Betsy Hp:
That Snape is cool! <g> Seriously, I think Snape has his game face 
on.  He's doing his best to get at the truth here without showing 
his own hand.

> Why does Snape return to the party rather than following Draco?

Betsy Hp:
Wasn't Draco heading back to his house?  There'd have been no 
benefit to following Draco, and walking past the party, immediately 
following Draco, would have only pulled suspicion down on either 
Snape or Draco.

> 14) How did this chapter affect your views on where Snape's        
> loyalties lie?

Betsy Hp:
It did nothing to sway them.  DDM!Snape, all the way! <g>

> Why do you think the chapter is titled "The Unbreakable Vow" when 
> the vow is barely mentioned?

Betsy Hp:
Because this is when Harry finds out that Snape has sworn to such a 
thing.  That information is important.

Really good discussion, Carol!  I'm glad I was finally able to 
tackle it. <g>

Betsy Hp