Scary Teachers - Good Teachers (was: Re: Hagrid and Snape...

[potioncat]

No: HPFGUIDX 152935

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, ClareWashbrook at ... wrote:
>
> Neri (mailto:nkafkafi at ...)  writes:
> 
> So what we know for certain is that Snape produced 12 NEWT students
> who got EE or higher and wanted to continue with the subject. But is
> this number high, low or average?
> 
> There are 25 students in this class. It looks like five different 
> DADA teachers, three of them hopeless, produced more than *twice* 
the
> number of NEWT students that Snape produced during these same years.
>  
> Clare:>  
> If there are 600 students in the school and we assume that the 
yearly  intake 
> is about the same, that means that there are approximately 85 
students  per 
> year.  If only 11 achieved the top grade (which is not stated or  
assumable)  
> then 13% of that year's students got an "O". 

Potioncat:
We are such fools to spend so much time over numbers and calculations 
when our source for the numbers is JKR. I'm sure in the RW, if we 
were her accountants, she would be providing us with good, strong 
data. But, unfortunately, she did not have Harry overhear the 
teachers comparing the data from the Department of Testing and 
Evaluation. So we don't know how the OWLs broke down.

If we insist on calculations, I think we have to use 40 as a base. No 
matter how many students JKR may indicate is in Harry's class, she 
only created 40. So if 10 out of 40 made O in Potions, it would be 20 
out of 80...etc. But even then, we don't know how many others made 
the score, but didn't take the course. Potions is the sort of course, 
like chemistry that you take if you need it. No one takes it for fun 
unless they're planning to be a scientist. 

Neri, you're being very logical.Might I remind you that wizards are 
rarely logical. It would make perfect sense that the Prophet would 
publish the new changes at Hogwarts. It would make more sense that 
Hogwarts would send letters telling students their OWL results, 
confirming the class assignment and giving them the supply list. Yet, 
it says in canon that McGonagall is going around at breakfast 
confirming whether the students met the OWL requirements for classes. 
That tells me the Deputy Headmistress doesn't even know the OWL 
grades for Gryffindors.


We seem to have a good idea of how many students are in some of the 
NEWT level classes, but we don't know how many could have been. I 
could probably make a case that DADA is required. You either take 
NEWT level or you take remedial. I could even quote canon to make it 
a sound theory. In that case, only those 25 (I'm taking your number 
here) met the requirements, leaving us still uncertain of how many 
met the requirements for Potions. However, I really think more 
students would want to take DADA than would want to take Potions. (No 
matter who is teaching it.)

Snape said he had a high pass rate and expected everyone in that 
class of Gryffindor-Slytherin to pass. He expected 100% pass. He 
expected Longbottom, Crabbe and Goyle to pass. Passing OWL doesn't 
get you into NEWT level, even with Slughorn. 

Before HBP the list debated what Snape's comment really meant and how 
it would play out. We talked about what numbers that might be or hwo 
it might compare to other courses. "A high pass rate" may mean that 
more of Snape's students pass each year than passed during Slughorn's 
terms. 

Again, we didn't get to overhear McGonagall say to Snape, "I'm so 
surprised that Longbottom did so well on the Potions OWL...and to 
think Crabbe and Goyle passed. With scores like this, Severus, you'll 
be seeing a merit raise this year." Yes, well, if that conversation 
did take place, Snape blew the raise.

My reaction after HBP was that the OWLs were very important to Percy, 
Hermione and us, to a lesser degree to Ron and Harry, but not at all 
to JKR.